You can get forever stuck at one place in Deus Ex even if you don't die?

oleg on 13/10/2008 at 17:48

Please explain to me the logic of it. I was running low on health, so I was having no legs and therefore, I couldn't jump. I couldn't jump on a crate to reach the window and climb out of it. So, IT REALLY MEANS I CAN GET FOREVER STUCK AT ONE PLACE WHILE PLAYING DEUS EX EVEN IF I DON'T DIE?

DDL on 13/10/2008 at 18:24

Logic?

You have no legs, thus you cannot jump. You need to jump to escape, you cannot jump. You cannot escape.

I'm not really sure logic is the appropriate term, here. You've gone and stuck a poor legless crippled JC inside a building, and it's somehow the game's fault?

oleg on 13/10/2008 at 18:39

But it's weird because you are still alive, yet the game doesn't end or tell you that you are stuck forever.

Ostriig on 13/10/2008 at 18:41

Quote Posted by oleg

Please explain to me the logic of it.

You've put yourself in a position where you no longer qualify to progress. As such, even though you aren't "dead", you have still "lost the game". I agree with DDL, it's not the game's fault - not anymore than it is when you jump off a high building and die from fall damage.

Edit:

Quote Posted by oleg

But it's weird because you are still alive, yet the game doesn't end or tell you that you are stuck forever.

I don't think it's too much to expect the player to be able to tell when they're in an unsolvable situation. Judging by your description, it appears reasonably obvious that it's time to load.

Silkworm on 13/10/2008 at 18:55

If you don't bring enough LAM's to the superfrieghter and mess up the flammable canisters near the weld points, you can also become permanently stuck.

D'Juhn Keep on 13/10/2008 at 19:01

There are an awful lot of LAMs lying around the Naval Base, Superfreighter and issued to soldiers/mercs there. While technically possible I can't see anyone actually managing to get stuck there.

Not to mention I just played with knives only and took out all the weld points with TNT crates.

oleg on 13/10/2008 at 19:05

So, I guess, it means, you have to be really careful not to jump into any holes if you don't have legs and if you don't see any stairs inside those holes.

demagogue on 13/10/2008 at 20:07

It's an old design issues that a lot of games have issues with, not just DX, creating areas that take certain abilities or tools to escape that can potentially be lacking.

(Another recent thing where this came up was in the Darkmod; they were debating not being able to carry bodies up ladders. The problem is that if an objective is to carry a body to X-room, it could create this kind of unwinnable situation if you need a ladder to get there. Then the response is that it's map-makers' responsibility to prevent those situations from being possible.)

It's supposed to be a design flaw to watch out for, but it's easy to pass unnoticed, especially if it's a rare occurrence. But since it's nothing you couldn't predict, the player should also reasonably watch out not to get trapped.

But anyway, there's not much to debate about it; what can you do? Give the dev's a symbolic finger-wagging, reload from an earlier point, and don't fall into that trap again.

ZylonBane on 14/10/2008 at 12:30

Quote Posted by oleg

So, I guess, it means, you have to be really careful not to jump into any holes if you don't have legs and if you don't see any stairs inside those holes.

Hey, if you want to roleplay JC as someone who's so SMEGGING STUPID that it would even occur to him to throw himself down a hole after getting his legs blown off, please, feel free.

rachel on 14/10/2008 at 16:45

Quote Posted by oleg

But it's weird because you are still alive, yet the game doesn't end or tell you that you are stuck forever.

No, seriously. Would you want someone to hold your hand while you play too?