Alvar on 16/7/2013 at 15:51
Quote Posted by svs
I actually joined TTLG because the discussion here
is better than just stating "Thief will be shit" with no apparent rationale to back the claim up, the way it too often is over at the official forum (save for a few good posters). I don't think that kind of attitude or expression of opinion will benefit anyone.
Again, history shows that the phenomena you describe of "suicide bombing posts" is because any attempt to go into rational detail frightens them and they will remove the offending insight. So, you are left with just the basic run in drop a bomb and get out. Again, the whole situation is very telling.
Quote Posted by Dia
Regarding the names of the T4 devs - they mean nothing to me.
And let's face it, the words Emmanuel Garcia are simply not comparable with names like Tim Stellmach.
Dia on 16/7/2013 at 18:30
Well said, Alvar. Now that name I know. But then again, I've had over a decade to learn it. ;)
svs on 16/7/2013 at 19:15
Quote Posted by Dia
You really are naïve if you believe that any feedback you provide at this point is going to mean diddly-squat. What are you, like 12 or something? EM has already stated that they're making T4 to appeal to 'the greater gaming audience'; their decisions about the creation/production of this game have already been made. Though I understand some of your questions might be answered, if you're asking about something that's already been clearly stated, of course. Otherwise they won't be able to tell you that yet but they know you're gonna love it..
Of course I've got the right to criticize! You don't have to take offense to it, just like I don't take offense to your condescending posting style. I've been around long enough to form my opinion on the stuff that's been going on here and EM forums, even if I only decided to join recently. I think this forums biggest problem regarding Thief is taking the predigested information based on
someone else's interpretation, not bothering to check the sources yourself (unlike Chade does, for example - he actually bothers to read the stuff).
You needn't worry that I'd be all blue eyes and expect the fans' feedback to be applied in verbatim - I never was. But now is undeniably the most opportune time to provide feedback, since we have at least something
concrete to work with. They either will implement the feedback or not; I've already stated most of my concerns here and over EM's forums. Until we get to see more, I remain hopeful and optimistic. And as I said, if the outcome will be crap in my opinion, I'll be the first to admit it, too.
Was there something funny about sponge? :D
Renault on 16/7/2013 at 19:33
I still think feedback is helpful, and EM is listening, even though it's been ignored in the past. There were a lot of complaints from E3 about The Shroud thing covering the corners of the screen, and also with the Quicktime/fire escape sequence. I would bet some of that will actually change before release based on what people were saying.
Dia on 16/7/2013 at 22:21
Well, since I've already been branded as a Negative Nelly, I'll have to say that imo you're being overly optimistic in believing EM is actually listening to any feedback we may have at this point. I mean, go ahead and believe if that's what rocks your boat, but I don't think EM is about to change anything about their development of T4 regardless of any input from any fans - here or on the EM T4 forums. Sure, they may change certain aspects of what they have so far, but not because of any input or feedback from fans; more likely because it doesn't fit with whatever direction they're trying to go with the game. They've already stated that they're aiming for the mass gaming audience, so why does anyone think they're going to listen to any of us at this late date? I think the time for that would've been when the devs first started creating the game; but since those devs are gone and replaced, I think it's a lesson in futility to believe any feedback we may have will ever be considered, let alone actually implemented.
However, I would absolutely LOVE it if EM proved me wrong on this. In fact, I double-dog-dare them to.
:ebil:
Quote Posted by svs
Was there something funny about sponge? :D
I've only ever heard the idiom as 'Throw in the towel', so, no offense mind you, 'sponge' struck me as funny. But then again, I lead a sheltered life. ;)
Shinrazero on 18/7/2013 at 19:00
I know there are many who have varying levels of optimism for the new game but this taffer wants to see the series live up to legacy of its predecessors and I don't think that is asking a lot. I would argue there is a difference between being open to change and just settling for whatever is marketed to us. While Thief is my favorite game series of all time, I do play other games. Yet, as gamer, I am absolutely weary with the sameness the permeates gaming as a whole. Looking back on the fine work LGS did, it is hard to ignore the risks they took at a time when games were dominated by the likes of Doom and Quake. Thief shook up gaming industry and the aftershocks are still present even today.
Now take a look at the games that are popular today and you will see little to no risk in their design. Flash and spectacle over substantive gameplay is the order of things. It is standard to take away the players control (literally) to tell a story, to give narrative. Games these days will hold your hand and lead you peacefully through the ride, predetermined and never too difficult. And here we are, watching nuThief employ these same generic gaming standards with a dose of limitation. For me, it is a difficult blow to take because Thief is so much more than that. Yes, they say you can toggle many of the training wheels that they want for their mass audience but that is irrelevant. Where's the risk? Why is it taboo to have challenging gameplay where the answer to problems is not readily available?
Anyway, at the rate things are going, the last measure of hope I have for this game is in the fans of our community. Assuming there is an editor (that's a fairly large assumption) I would hope to see the same excellent creativity from dedicated FM authors and those who could possibly correct some of the more heinous additions/subtractions to the core mechanics of Thief.
SubJeff on 19/7/2013 at 07:12
Well in other news - over on the What Is In thread some of us are only just realising how much context sensitive nonsense there will be in Thief 4.
Dishonored didn't do this and more importantly TDM doesn't.
It's unreal, ridiculous.
