Phydeaux on 27/6/2006 at 09:10
Actually, I don't even know why the fuck I answered you. I could say something like "I like cheese" or "kittens are fluffy" and you'll get your panties in a twist about it.
Scots Taffer on 27/6/2006 at 09:14
Quote Posted by Phydeaux
"I like cheese"
I happen to be lactose intolerant, MOTHERFUCKER.
Myoldnamebroke on 27/6/2006 at 09:18
Quote Posted by Thief13x
Yup, I can definatly agree living close to miami. Not to mention the overcrowded countries are coming to the US for a reason...lets not make the US another one....no offense to any immigrants
I know I'm certainly considering sneaking into the US because of England's outrageous population density.
Also: oi, twits! It's not the term 'illegal' that is offensive, it's the removal of 'immigrant'. Replacing 'illegal' with something else doesn't change it 'unlawful immigrants', 'uninvited immigrants' whatever - it's the dropping of 'immigrant' and referring to a group of people as simply 'illegals' that is dehumanising.
Phydeaux - as you seem to be a fan of legal immigrants, do you think the process of immigrating legally should be made easier so more of the clearly many people that want to come and work in America can do so, and so pay taxes and all that jazz that makes the 'hurrah' rather than 'bah'?
Phydeaux on 27/6/2006 at 09:44
Quote Posted by Myoldnamebroke
Also: oi, twits! It's not the term 'illegal' that is offensive, it's the removal of 'immigrant'. Replacing 'illegal' with something else doesn't change it 'unlawful immigrants', 'uninvited immigrants' whatever - it's the dropping of 'immigrant' and referring to a group of people as simply 'illegals' that is dehumanising.
I say "illegals" for the sake of brevity. It has nothing to do with dehumanising or anything like that.
Quote:
Phydeaux - as you seem to be a fan of legal immigrants, do you think the process of immigrating legally should be made easier so more of the clearly many people that want to come and work in America can do so, and so pay taxes and all that jazz that makes the 'hurrah' rather than 'bah'?
No. There's restrictions on the numbers of legals that we allow in, and they're there for a reason. Illegals completely sidestep those reasons and screw up any balance we were trying to maintain. Making the illegals legal would also screw up the balances. And it's not just a balance between the taxes one pays and the drain they create, it also has to do with wages, costs of living, employment/unemployment rates, the general economy, and other factors that I honestly don't have a great understanding of myself.
JACKofTrades on 27/6/2006 at 11:01
Quote Posted by Strontium Dog
The ilegal immigrant issue has been done to death, and it's not the issue here, that's why I'm "ignoring" it. I'd prefer to focus on the way my language is slowly being butchered and filled with loaded, racist terminology, if you don't mind.
Why not abandon your language and learn Spanish?
Steezo on 27/6/2006 at 11:05
I will say this, the process is entirely too beaurocratic. I know Marines, damnit warfighters with medals and ribbons up the wazoo, who have spent the better part of four years getting naturalized. This is after putting their lives on the line overseas.
I think we should start deporting career politicians and their families since they are of no benifit to this country.
Edit: Their staffers too, since they're a hidden threat most poeple don't see. Regimes change but the party staff doesn't.
SD on 27/6/2006 at 11:10
Quote Posted by Phydeaux
I say "illegals" for the sake of brevity. It has nothing to do with dehumanising or anything like that.
Sure, you might not intend to dehumanise people by using that term, but it
is a dehumanising term.
I know that some words which are fine in the US are seen as offensive over here (eg the term "Paki" is bandied around with nonchalance, whereas in the UK, it's one of the very worst racial epithets). But I think it's been explained often enough already in this thread how "illegals" carries inherent and implicit undertones that leave a bitter taste in the mouth.
Quote Posted by JACKofTrades
Why not abandon your language and learn Spanish?
What? And indeed, why?
Scots Taffer on 27/6/2006 at 11:33
Quote Posted by Strontium Dog
Sure, you might not intend to dehumanise people by using that term, but it
is a dehumanising term.
That. Is why you failed.
Phydeaux on 27/6/2006 at 12:03
Quote Posted by Strontium Dog
Sure, you might not intend to dehumanise people by using that term, but it
is a dehumanising term.
I know that some words which are fine in the US are seen as offensive over here (eg the term "Paki" is bandied around with nonchalance, whereas in the UK, it's one of the very worst racial epithets). But I think it's been explained often enough already in this thread how "illegals" carries inherent and implicit undertones that leave a bitter taste in the mouth.
That's hardly the same thing. Derogations like "Paki" or "Chink" or "Gerry" are one thing, calling an illegal immigrant an "illegal" is completely different and has no negative connotation attached to it beyond any attached to the term "illegal immigrant" in the first place (which would be in the same vein as "convict", "felon", or "gang member"). Saying "illegals" is no different (except in length) than saying "illegal immigrants". As though calling them anything else will make them any less illegal. :rolleyes:
Maybe "illegal" has a more extreme connotation across the pond, but judging by other peoples responses here, I'll just continue to consider you a complete prat. You're the only one complaining about the "term".
The only thing I can think of is that it's dehumanizing, but only in your mind, because you've invented that connotation yourself. I can kinda understand that; I myself feel a bit strange saying the word "Mexican" (I'd rather say Hispanic, even though a person from Mexico is by definition "Mexican", and there's nothing wrong with calling a Mexican "Mexican"), but that's only because I hear other people use it disparagingly. But thinking that other people have this twinge with the word "Mexican" would be pure idiocy, because it's only in my mind. For the record,
real derogations give me this twinge too, no matter how often I hear them casually. Which is probably where this twinge for "Mexican" came from. If this is where you get upset with the term, "illegals", I can sorta understand.
But even then, you're still being a fucking prat about it.
jprobs on 27/6/2006 at 12:06
Again. I point out the fact that BBC is ALSO using the term "illegals" when reporting on a story about deporting "illegals" from the UK. Point is StD, you may think your Europe is on a higher plane of thinking than that of the US, but the reality is you have shit in your crack too..(article of reference: (
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/4992298.stm) http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/4992298.stm )
And yes, there should be a softening of the immigration policy in the US. That might slow down the flood of "illegals" crossing the border. I believe that most of the people who cross the border illegally want to in fact become an american citizen.
Immigrants built this country. I am of Irish descent myself, and realize I would not be here had the policies in place today existed back in the mid 1800s.
The Irish were spat upon, treated as second class citizens, accused of raising the unemployment, accused of taking jobs away from "good" americans, being criminals, bringing disease, etc... But they came here LEGALLY and were welcomed by the US government even though the common man was less than cordial to them.
Not sure where I was going with that except to say that the US has had many immigration problems in the past (cubans, hatians, etc) and it takes some time to overcome the situation. But we do fix our own problems and we will fix this one.
