Sulphur on 27/2/2017 at 20:09
Quote Posted by Renzatic
It's not the art and style he's talking about, but the way the world is constructed. Morrowind and Oblivion used their worldbuilder, which allows you to raise, lower, and sculpt hills and mountains on what's basically a heightmap. There's no overlap on their landscapes. Piranhabytes modeled all their landscapes by hand exclusively with 3D models, and was able to throw in a ton more variety in the way things are laid out. Like rocky outcroppings, little paths on sheer walls, and things being under and over a lot of other things. It makes for a more interesting and realistic world.
Skyrim is about the only game that's come close to replicating that, and that's only because Bethesda used a lot more modeled assets in their world construction.
I get that he's talking about the design and construction
pipeline Beth used to create Morrowind and that there's essentially prefabbed models slapped together and smacked onto that landscape heightmap, and there's nothing more egregious than the ridiculously small number of prefabbed dungeon bits they snapped in like Lego throughout the world.
Morrowind does plenty to vary its landscape and box models though, by making its skin and architecture
alien, and that's precisely where Oblivion failed. So when I hear it described as generic, the immediate reaction is going to be '...huh?'
That's... well, it's certainly something you expect someone to be living in if it were Morrowind. Good god does that look bizarre.
N'Al on 27/2/2017 at 20:13
Quote Posted by Thirith
the game never gives you any reason to do so,
Exactly this. From a gameplay perspective you're pretty much running from map marker to map marker, the open world might as well not be there.* It guarantees an amazing atmosphere, so I wouldn't want to lose the cities at all, but they don't work as 'open worlds' for me.
*Bear in mind, I've only played
1,
2,
Liberation, plus 30min of
Brotherhood, so far.
chk772 on 27/2/2017 at 20:25
Quote Posted by Sulphur
I get that he's talking about the design and construction
pipeline Beth used to create Morrowind and that there's essentially prefabbed models slapped together and smacked onto that landscape heightmap, and there's nothing more egregious than the ridiculously small number of prefabbed dungeon bits they snapped in like Lego throughout the world.
Morrowind does plenty to vary its landscape and box models though, by making its skin and architecture
alien, and that's precisely where Oblivion failed. So when I hear it described as generic, the immediate reaction is going to be '...huh?'
Actually, i think Morrowind is even more generic looking than Oblivion. But, let's not argue, let's just say we disagree. In the meantime, you may want to to a little research, what games journalists, and others say about it, and you'll see that many essentially share my view point. Especially comparing Morrowind to Gothic 2, 2 games which came out in a similar period of time, Gothic 2 is kind of the antithesis to Morrowind's generic design.
That all said, there's absolutely no reason why not to enjoy the game anyway.
Renzatic on 27/2/2017 at 20:27
Quote Posted by Sulphur
I get that he's talking about the design and construction
pipeline Beth used to create Morrowind and that there's essentially prefabbed models slapped together and smacked onto that landscape heightmap, and there's nothing more egregious than the ridiculously small number of prefabbed dungeon bits they snapped in like Lego throughout the world.
Exactly. Style and construction are two separate things here. MW is able to get away with a lot due to its style, which is about as unique as you can get in a fantasy RPG. But the way the world was built was pretty bog standard.
The end result is a game that's fascinating by the culture it presents, it's style, and it's story, but it isn't quite as fun to explore as Gothic 2, which had this layered verticality thing going on that couldn't be replicated in MW.
Sulphur on 27/2/2017 at 20:37
Quote Posted by chk772
Actually, i think Morrowind is even more generic looking than Oblivion. But, let's not argue, let's just say we disagree. In the meantime, you may want to to a little research, what games journalists, and others say about it, and you'll see that many essentially share my view point. Especially comparing Morrowind to Gothic 2, 2 games which came out in a similar period of time, Gothic 2 is kind of the antithesis to Morrowind's generic design.
That all said, there's absolutely no reason why not to enjoy the game anyway.
I'm fine to agree to disagree. Perhaps it's a matter of taste, though I suspect it's simply just that we have different perspectives. I read plenty of Morrowind's reviews at the time, and my takeaways from those were that Morrowind's quest journal was terrible and its combat sucked balls, which they do, while it looked brilliant and was fun to trawl around in, which it was... until the cliff racers happened.
Now, having slapped my keyboard hard enough to have spat out multiple posts on this topic in the past half hour, you may find this funny, but: I really, really dislike everything about Morrowind apart from its art style.
chk772 on 27/2/2017 at 20:39
And i did not talk about that at all. I talked about its architecture, and world design. ;) Morrowind and Oblivion are also very different in setting, yet i stated both as examples of the same generic design.
Renzatic on 27/2/2017 at 20:41
Morrowind was awesome, cuz I had a Geforce 3 at the time, and got the crazy water.
Sulphur on 27/2/2017 at 20:43
Quote Posted by chk772
And i did not talk about that at all. I talked about its architecture, and world design. ;) Morrowind and Oblivion are also very different in setting, yet i stated both as examples of the same generic design.
Yeah dude, I think we have different definitions of architecture going on here. 's okay though, this is as good a place as any to leave it where it's at.
Quote Posted by Renzatic
Morrowind was awesome, cuz I had a Geforce 3 at the time, and got the crazy water.
That water was crazy enough to entirely tank the frame rate, yes.
Renzatic on 27/2/2017 at 20:48
It ran better than Deus Ex.
