nicked on 31/8/2006 at 11:33
I think it's a testament to the amazingness of Looking Glass that they didn't go:
"Yeah, for the last level, lets do a really cool thing where Garrett gets a new robot body and can shoot fireballs and electricity, and then do a big showdown with Karrass reborn in his own mega-battle-suit!"
How many other game companies would have done that just to make a "cool" ending?
themetalian on 31/8/2006 at 17:05
Quote Posted by 242
When I played T2 for the first time I was VERY afraid of him.
:tsktsk::tsktsk: You were scared? Karras is as scary as a drunk Benny waving his sword around. :p
Deary me. :tsktsk:
Goldmoon Dawn on 31/8/2006 at 17:17
Quote Posted by nicked
How many other game companies would have done that just to make a "cool" ending?
Right, and that's not all. Just like the Trickster in the first game, Garrett can never actually harm him!
Quote Posted by themetalian
Karras is as scary as a drunk Benny waving his sword around.
Considering that you get to see Karras but a few times throughout the entire game, I believe the missed point had something to do with atmosphere and implications of the unknown.
*That* is what made LGS great.
june gloom on 31/8/2006 at 18:02
Quote Posted by themetalian
:tsktsk::tsktsk: You were scared? Karras is as scary as a drunk Benny waving his sword around. :p
Deary me. :tsktsk:
he's got a little bit of that kefka (final fantasy VI villian) feel to him. kefka was crazy, brilliant and twisted too- even moreso than karras was.
242 on 31/8/2006 at 19:09
Quote Posted by themetalian
:tsktsk::tsktsk: You were scared? Karras is as scary as a drunk Benny waving his sword around. :p
Deary me. :tsktsk:
Yep, I was really scared. He seemed quite a sinister person to me, and still seems.
user1010 on 1/9/2006 at 11:34
Wow, I must applaud everybody for giving such detailed thoughts on Karras mental state, it's been quite an interesting read.
I think he began as a bullied child aswell, and he definently exhibits sociopathic tendencies, ie holding up a facade to everyone that he's just another religious leader while secretly making his servants to kill off everybody, including his own followers. However, his illness could also be the result of oppression during his childhood, parents that perhaps demanded too much from him in terms of studying? (that would also conveniently explain his genious in constructing things)
As for charisma, Karras would have to have it to gain that many followers to his religion. Also, haven't you people ever noticed that the mechanists generally have a more intelligent set of grammar and cite longer verses of scripture? (or am I wrong?)
As for the thing that made him snap, perhaps the order of the hammer had a sort of re-awakening after the whole trickster incident in which they tensed up and started reverting more to traditional values.. which would entail cracking down alot harder and more frequently on things deemed heretical.. technology included. Perhaps Karras didn't leave of his own volition, perhaps he was kicked out? (now there's an interesting theory)
I think the reason that he's got such a heavy speech impediment is due to the fact that they otherwise thought Stephen Russels voice would be recognized both as Garrett and as Karras by the players :D
(when I found out about this, I was severely shocked, but after listening to some clips really carefully I can detect some small similarities!)
But I must admit that I was scared shitless when I was eavesdropping in on the conversation in the mechanist monestary, I was expecting Karras to come walking out of the door at any second! (not to mention that truart also had me spooked alot!) But, the thing that got me really creeped out was when the tone in Karras voice changed to a sort of maniacal tone.. a happy "kill everybody and play around with their blood!" type of voice. Very chilling.
DarthMRN on 1/9/2006 at 16:36
How does one become a Hammerite without a genuine calling?
And with a geuine calling, why would he need something as clicheed as a traumatic childhood to begin having visions where the Builder told him to eradicate all life and replace it with machinery.
This thread gives me the impression that people think he created his delusions himself as a personal excuse for magalomania, but did you ever consider that he actually thought he was the Builder's Chosen One, and acted out of faith every bit as much as greed?
RavynousHunter on 1/9/2006 at 17:24
yeah, Karras has to be a friggin genious. I mean, he took a world stuck in about the 600's or so, and created things that were only possible in say the 1950's or so, ie: record players, security cameras with an IFF function, and the like. i also agree somewhat that the Mechanists were kinda like a Generation-X for the Hammers, a bunch of young acolytes who see a lot of possibility, but with no ability to utilize it. To them, Karras was kind of like Charles Manson, or David Korresh, he was extremely brilliant, and very charismatic.
One question I have is, what happened to Cavador after Karras died? was he killed by the Pagans? did he escape? and what of the other Mechanists that would still litter the streets of the City without thier leader? TDS was so inexplanatory on these things... arrrrrggggg! :nono:
I think, if Cavvy survived, he wouldve gone and gathered the Mechanist remnants, and become Karras' replacement. FM anyone? :thumb:
nicked on 1/9/2006 at 19:54
I think it's pretty clear that upon Karras' death, it would be obvious to everyone what he had intended. The mechanists would realise their whole faith was built on lies and either reject it entirely or perhaps come crawling back to the Hammers. The people of the City may also have rioted and killed a lot of the mechanists when it emerged what had happened. This would also explain why no mechanist buildings are left in TDS - they were razed to the ground.
As for Cavador:
"Our friend Cavador just spilled his guts."
"Not... literally?"
"It wasn't necessary."
I don't think the pagans would deliberately kill a living creature, even a mechanist, unless they posed a direct threat. I imagine Cavador may have been released eventually?
Goldmoon Dawn on 2/9/2006 at 00:50
Quote Posted by nicked
I don't think the pagans would deliberately kill a living creature, even a mechanist, unless they posed a direct threat. I imagine Cavador may have been released eventually?
The Pagans only have the one enemy, The Hammers.
Because the Mechanists *were* moving away from the use of wood, suggesting leniency is interesting.
