Cipheron on 16/4/2023 at 02:59
Quote Posted by Hit Deity
Not sure why, just a personal preference, I guess, but I dislike dual- and triple-classed characters. Is it possible to play (and enjoy, ofc) with single-classed characters?
EDIT: trying to make this shorter. Single-class characters are fine. They level up faster and are more variable in their abilities and gear. It's actually a good idea to keep the amount of classes to a minimum for the first time through the game. You won't be as OP as possible, but you might have a more enjoyable and tense situation going.
BTW the multi-class system, this isn't a free for all like later D&D versions, these are limited race-specific combos similar to the old 'Basic' D&D where elves were fighter/mages automatically, except with more options. There's usually only one class they can fully raise, with any other being limited to roughly half the max level.
To see the most of what you can see in the first game: the classic fighter, cleric, mage, thief. Referring to page 29 of the EOB 2 manual, dwarves can fully level as fighter and elves can fully level as mage, and they can read dwarven and elvish writing, respectively, so you don't miss flavor text. Paladins have some unique stuff too, so if you only ever plan to play through once you'd miss some stuff without one. But to squeeze in all the other stuff you'd need to double-class one of the other characters as a thief to keep lockpicking, or swap out the fighter and lose the ability to read dwarven runes (cosmetic only).
Another option, that only keeps single class, is to notice that game #2 caps out at level 13, and many races have a level limit of 12. If you definitely never want to play EOB III then you can just pretend the level limits don't exist, and go for a Human Paladin, Dwarven Cleric, Elven Mage, Halfling Thief.
---
As for the Buck Rogers games, I'm really surprised they're not on GOG already. I think there may be an issue with the licensing of the Buck Rogers IP.
ahmallama on 16/4/2023 at 06:14
theres alot of good suggestions here! i've been trying to think of any others than the ones i started out with but i keep coming up short.
WingedKagouti on 16/4/2023 at 09:34
Quote Posted by Jason Moyer
I wonder what kind of legal hell the Buck Rogers rights are in.
From a quick look, there seems to have been some court battles for the rights over the last decade or so.
Cipheron on 16/4/2023 at 10:30
Quote Posted by WingedKagouti
From a quick look, there seems to have been some court battles for the rights over the last decade or so.
Now that it comes up I vaguely remember reading an article about that. Probably the last time I checked whether it was on GOG.
(
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/question-who-owns-buck-rogers-heads-trial-1033309/)
Quote:
The judge notes that the Dilles held registrations on “Buck Rogers” in the 1980s and had licensed those rights for games, comics and books.
Then again, leading to the second big trademark question, it's possible that the Dilles may have abandoned those rights. Many of the licensing agreements were terminated. In the late 1990s, there was an agreement with Walt Disney Pictures for a new Buck Rogers film or TV show, but nothing was made. The Dilles point to the way it continued to license “Buck Rogers” for vintage merchandising and role-playing game.
This is actually the other issue. SSI no longer have the license for Buck Rogers. So there's nobody who is both a license holder and also copyright holder of the games themselves, and the expected profit of clearing this up is probably not on the radar of anyone involved, since they're eying a potential billion dollar movie deal as the pay-off for winning the fight over trademark ownership.
Yeah, you can only run this on DosBox or on some online site, not GOG or something.
Hit Deity on 16/4/2023 at 13:48
Thanks, I might try the Buck Rogers game.
I still have a major crush on Colonel Deering. :-P {That was just a side thought; I doubt she's in the game, or will even look anywhere close to the TV version..} I've got the BR Boxed Set on DVD that I rewatch occasionally. I'll most likely enjoy the game.
driver on 16/4/2023 at 16:35
Quote Posted by Cipheron
Beholder I is great. The 2nd one is good too but the first one is really tightly put together.
Only a few head's up:
Party design, to avoid mistakes later...
Did thieves have much use in the EotB games? Most thief skills such as stealth, pickpocket, backstab etc weren't implemented, which left them with lockpicking, and as I recall there weren't many opportunities to use that, and even then that just meant you didn't have to find the key for that particular door. My memory might be fuzzy on that point though, as it has been some time since I played them.
:edit:
As Starker mentioned it earlier, Lands of Lore is also a good choice for similar tile-based dungeon crawlers. made by Westwood (same people that did EotB) it's a more well-rounded game with things like NPCs you can
talk to! Shops to
trade with! Outside areas that don't
suck!It is more limited in there no character creation and you're stuck with Fighter, Mage, 'Thief' or All-rounder as your choices, and the characters that join you are assigned by the story and you have no choices (barring one brief companion you can optionally obtain near the start) but it's a solid game and a huge improvement over the EotB series.
Cipheron on 16/4/2023 at 22:31
Quote Posted by driver
Did thieves have much use in the EotB games? Most thief skills such as stealth, pickpocket, backstab etc weren't implemented, which left them with lockpicking, and as I recall there weren't many opportunities to use that, and even then that just meant you didn't have to find the key for that particular door. My memory might be fuzzy on that point though, as it has been some time since I played them.
I was more thinking about someone who's only going to do a single playthrough of the games, so the advice was centered around having all the main character types and skills. Hence my final party suggestion which included a Paladin, Cleric, Mage, Thief, and both an Elf and a Dwarf. That way you see all the main game mechanics, and can read all the inscriptions etc.
A thief can also use the bow and arrows, which neither a second mage nor cleric could, so their main role would become an archer.
It's one thing to say you can do without lockpicking, or getting the Dwarf / Elf related lore. But it's another thing to just say those can be skipped with never having seen them.
Actually this party set-up is tempting for me to run through the games again with it. With only single classes, there will be no need to grind levels. Additional cleric power can be picked up with an NPC in the late game, when it actually becomes important.
Quote:
As Starker mentioned it earlier, Lands of Lore is also a good choice for similar tile-based dungeon crawlers. made by Westwood (same people that did EotB) it's a more well-rounded game with things like NPCs you can talk to! Shops to trade with! Outside areas that don't suck!
Now there's one that *I* missed at the time. Somehow that one never came across my radar. If I'd realized there was a true spiritual successor to EOB II then I'd have been on that.
I still plan to take another stab at EOB III though with my existing party, but it's just not as polished as a game. The engine wasn't the Westwood one: SSI ported it into their in-house engine, which was laggy as fuck. So EOB I and II are really snappy and fast, but EOB III is laggy and has loading bars.
But I think I should knock off EOB III before trying Lands of Lore. Better to end on a high note!
Hit Deity on 17/4/2023 at 01:03
LoL 1,2,&3 sound like my kind of games. Thanks.
And all 3 are on GoG. Nice.
Starker on 17/4/2023 at 05:40
I remember the sequels being somewhat disappointing, though not really bad, exactly. Throne of Chaos, though, is my favourite out of all the Dungeon Master imitations. It's really a shame it's not nearly as well known as the Eye of the Beholder series. It's got amazing voice acting, one of the best stories of the bunch, and a much more polished interface. The mechanics are a fair bit more simplified compared to Dungeon Master, though, so don't expect much in that regard.
driver on 17/4/2023 at 07:57
Yeah, I played LoL 2 and found it a bit aimless and disappointing, never played the third game. GoG packages the first two games together, so you can give the sequel a go and if you enjoy it you could pick up the third. The voice acting is very good in the first, but it does suffer from the Bethesda problem of having their biggest star (in this case Patrick Stewart) vanish after the opening. The sequel fell into that late 90s trap of FMV and the acting was... less good.
:edit:
Cipheron, wasn't meaning to criticise your party choice for EotB, it's a solid party for most D&D games. It was more that when I thought about it, thieves seemed under-utilized. Had there been, say, treasure chests that could only be lockpicked or traps that could be disarmed, they'd have had a bit more use. As you say, they're more use as quick-levelling archers than much else.
