godismygoldfish on 24/2/2005 at 18:49
Quote Posted by d'Spair
Ah, I completely can't understand this. Water could be easily implemented in UT2003/2004 maps with the help of the special zone. Why did you delete this in T3Ed?..
Probably becasue the thing is barely Unreal after all the changes made.
Krypt on 24/2/2005 at 18:51
Quote Posted by d'Spair
Ah, I completely can't understand this. Water could be easily implemented in UT2003/2004 maps with the help of the special zone. Why did you delete this in T3Ed?..
The Flesh engine is a completely different engine from Unreal. It only uses the same editor; the renderer, physics and about everything else are proprietary. So none of the Unreal engine capabilities to create water exist in Flesh, and ISA didn't code our own as we cut water from the games long before anyone started programming it.
bukary on 24/2/2005 at 19:15
Quote Posted by Krypt
we cut water from the games long before anyone started programming it.
Can you tell us why?
deadman on 24/2/2005 at 19:20
Quote Posted by Krypt
ISA didn't code our own as we cut water from the games long before anyone started programming it.
Looks like that's the reason water couldn't work.. It wasn't intended to be in the game from day one. We all mistakenly believed, like rope arrows (which could've been another thing you guys has never intended to be in the game?), that you, for some reason,
couldn't get it to work, not
wouldn't.
Hey Bukary, long time no see :) Now, stop taffing about and start building Thief 3 FMs! :joke:
deadman.
bukary on 24/2/2005 at 19:26
Quote Posted by deadman
Hey Bukary, long time no see :) Now, stop taffing about and start building Thief 3 FMs! :joke:
Will do. But my dream was to build nice, huge waterpool in T3Ed... ;)
Krypt on 24/2/2005 at 19:36
Quote Posted by deadman
Looks like that's the reason water couldn't work.. It wasn't intended to be in the game from day one. We all mistakenly believed, like rope arrows (which could've been another thing you guys has never intended to be in the game?), that you, for some reason,
couldn't get it to work, not
wouldn't.
No, we fully intended to have water in both DX:IW and T-DS in the initial designs. I suppose maybe someone will get mad at me for saying this, but we had a LOT of problems with implementing the Havok physics in our engine. There were a lot of things we just couldn't get working to our satisfaction and still keep up with our development schedule, and water was one of the big ones. We cut water because of the amount of development time it would have required for the physics programming and all of the art effects and extra animations and such. We decided the amount of time and resources it would take to put water in wasn't worth the gameplay benefit. Rope arrows were also intended to be in T-DS, but were cut because of the problems with implementing them. I wasn't on the Thief team yet when rope arrows were cut so I don't know the details, but I believe it was pretty much entirely for technical/schedule reasons. Everyone was pretty sad when they had to go.
d'Spair on 24/2/2005 at 19:52
Ah, shame on Eidos.
And on Havok too. This damn physics engine killed ropes and water. Did it worth it?... Well... Hard to say.
deadman on 24/2/2005 at 19:57
Quote Posted by Krypt
We cut water because of the amount of development time it would have required for the physics programming and all of the art effects and extra animations and such. We decided the amount of time and resources it would take to put water in wasn't worth the gameplay benefit.
Well, as you can probably tell, most of us would disagree with that conclusion :laff:. Same with the rope arrows. Of course you guys are under tight deadlines as it is, but we really cried a lot of tears (and wanted to shed a lot of blood) over the lack of those two elements.
And it's just sad the console haters were right about everything being limited by the X-Box's capabilities. It's too bad you guys couldn't have done the PC port and had another team simplify down from there to the X-Box, instead of building a game which right away could run on both.
And thanks for stopping by to chat with us :thumb:.
Quote Posted by bukary
Will do. But my dream was to build nice, huge waterpool in T3Ed... ;)
Heh, I know what you mean, good buddy ;) :nono:
deadman.
Darkwarrior_II on 24/2/2005 at 21:13
Who gives a shit about water and rope arrows? They didn't make the original Thief games great, just as their absence doesn't make Thief III poor.
Mr. Perfect on 24/2/2005 at 21:17
I suppose the question now is could the fan community create scripts and animations to cover what the devs didn't have time to do, or is that beyond what the Thief 3 Editor can do?
