Watchmen Movie - TTLG Forums

Scots Taffer on 29/7/2008 at 01:03

I agree to a certain extent. To be clear, I'm not against world-building flavour text, games like Thief got the balance right, games like Deus Ex went too far in the opposite direction down to having people's fucking laundry lists lying around.

As for The Watchman: I'm not saying that it's an inferior way to tell the story of whatever is in the text parts at the end as I don't know what's in them to be honest, I'm just continuing on with the main thrust of the story; it's that I find them an unpleasant addition to a comic book/graphic novel and would rather see them incorporated into the medium rather than having to face a wall of text after some briskly moving artwork and scriptwriting.

doctorfrog on 29/7/2008 at 05:01

edit: ooh, double-banned ^^

Quote Posted by Scots Taffer

I don't know that it's a direct comparison between DX and Watchmen with regard to text files. I do know that with DX, I found the reading of the various PDAs something of a chore, but I felt a compulsion to read them anyway, which was a little irritating, even if the game didn't "make" me read them. That said, I'm still glad I did.

With regard to the wall-o-text at the end of Watchmen chapters, I think you need to think of this as it was originally published. Let's say you're into comics, and you're pretty well blown away by how this is going on as a send-up of all the tropes you're used to, or at least intrigued. Let's also say that you've heard it's a 12 chapter serial, and you're on chapter 3, and it's getting really, really good. Chapter 4's a month off. Yeah, you tore through the whole thing the moment you got it home, then re-read it a couple times until you're satisfied you've given the artwork the time of day. Chapter 4 is still a month off.

You skipped the Hollis autobio because that's reading, and reading's for nerds, but you can't get enough of the comic world. You sit down and read it, and it adds some depth to the story, the characters. They've even gone to the trouble of making it look like it was photocopied out of a book. It's an extra, but it's pretty well integrated, not as good as the rest of the comic, but you can't recall anyone putting quite this much extra effort into a comic like this.

In this context, I think the wall of text suits the medium just fine. I'm not well suited to say this, though, since Watchmen is the only comic I've ever read (had to read it for a class in college).

Modern analog: think of it as the extras on a DVD. Ignore them if you like, or watch them. But complain about them?

BEAR on 29/7/2008 at 05:03

Quote Posted by Scots Taffer

I liked Deus Ex but I tend to agree. In thief the written story elements were just tantalizing glimpses into an otherwise mysterious world, and SS2 voicelogs added incredible depth to an area, but I think Deus Ex didn't really need them quite so much as well.

edit: damn you doctorfrog. The first ban was just to case the joint and ban him a little.

Scots Taffer on 29/7/2008 at 05:07

To be fair, I made a passing comment about the wall of text's suitability which was pounced on so I felt it prudent to elucidate further but really, it's not so much that I'm bothered by it as unaffected by it - the information provided, at least in the first snip of autobiography, seemed so unnecessary and out of place that I wasn't thrilled about reading more of them.

I think the DX analogy holds because if I happen to miss some key piece of story on a datacube or whatever because the earlier ones full of irrelevant fluff bored the shit out of me, how is that my fault? If it's only flavour and not need-to-know plot, I'm not complaining, but since this was my first time through I thought I'd raise the question. Your modern analog is fine, if you're aware that it's the case before you skip them.

Muzman on 29/7/2008 at 06:35

Watchmen's one's of those stories that's thoroughly woven. The relevance of some details doesn't become apparent until you've finished it, and sometimes not until the second read through.
I didn't feel like reading in a comic either so I skipped the first couple of extras, but I caught enough details that down the track I felt I was missing out so I went back and read them (then at about half way I went back to the beginning and just about read the whole half again)

Pyrian on 29/7/2008 at 22:55

Quote Posted by Scots Taffer

Please tell me you're not advocating that games are not capable of telling stories without the use of holocubes stuffed with tiny text?

Okay. I am not advocating that games are not capable of telling stories without the use of holocubes stuffed with tiny text. I am merely advocating that it's not a deadly sin to use them, either - especially when they fit in well.

Quote Posted by Scots Taffer

I think the DX analogy holds because if I happen to miss some key piece of story on a datacube or whatever because the earlier ones full of irrelevant fluff bored the shit out of me, how is that my fault? If it's only flavour and not need-to-know plot, I'm not complaining, but since this was my first time through I thought I'd raise the question.

Given how little of DX could not be solved with a judiciously placed rocket, I don't think it's easy to miss truly key story. I, however, liked all of the DX flavour text, right down to the non-existent novel excerpts and laundry lists. They...fit.

Scots Taffer on 30/7/2008 at 06:17

Quote Posted by Vivian

I dunno... realistically, is there any chance this film won't be a horrible stumpfuck like every other Alan Moore film ever attempted? They all look kinda young, for one thing. Comedian looks promising.

Sorry for resurrecting such an old post, but I just finished the Watchmen and decided to start the thread from scratch for anything I may have missed. There's a vast chance this could be fucked up and the youthful (and yes, sexy) appearance of the superheroes is already a step in the wrong direction. They have the look of the universe nailed but if they fail to nail the human side of the equation then it's just another stylistic empty exercise, much like 300 (which wasn't even as stylish looking as this).

And man oh man, (http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1566441#post1566441) to the thread Digi linked on 300 and my comments on Moore being a misogynist in Sin City how unsurprised was I to find that Silk Spectre enjoyed having the shit knocked out of her and nearly raped... more or less.

I enjoyed the Watchmen and think it's an interesting candidate for adapatation, but there should be no problem in paring this movie down to something resembling a neater 2-2.5max hr mystery with subtext, pretty much all the Black Freighter and flavour-text can be jettisoned without worrying about the impact upon storyline at all.

Vivian on 30/7/2008 at 06:55

Do you mean Frank Miller? He's the guy who wrote Sin City and 300. And yeah, I guess you're right - this could actually work. It's just that all his other stuff which I think would have been easier to turn into a really good movie (V for Vendetta, frinstance) has already been totally fucked over, so this woud be the exception rather than the rule.

Scots Taffer on 30/7/2008 at 06:59

Miller... Moore... all the same. lol.

Fringe on 30/7/2008 at 13:30

Above post is the equivalent of throwing down a smoke grenade after a really loud, embarrassing fart.

Don't pay attention to it, fanboys. That's what he wants!