zacharias on 24/6/2013 at 02:32
Looks like you could vary your line weight some more where appropriate (ie. folds of skin and crevices will have less weight than a form/no form border); that will go some way to reducing the flat look.
Also you mentioned your forearm is killing you..sounds like you are still doing wristy actions (drawing from the wrist) or your position is bad somehow. That's what the draw from the shoulder is about: it's both technical (the drawings tend to be more bold and less finicky) and also a comfort thing, much less tiring than a wristy action oo-er :p)
Renzatic on 24/6/2013 at 04:16
Quote Posted by zacharias
Looks like you could vary your line weight some more where appropriate (ie. folds of skin and crevices will have less weight than a form/no form border); that will go some way to reducing the flat look.
That's a skill I intend on practicing once I've got a little more experience under my belt. Right now, I'm more concerned with being able to follow what I'm drawing with my eyes and getting my contours drawn correctly than I am with anything else. Everything in good time.
Quote:
Also you mentioned your forearm is killing you..sounds like you are still doing wristy actions (drawing from the wrist) or your position is bad somehow. That's what the draw from the shoulder is about: it's both technical (the drawings tend to be more bold and less finicky) and also a comfort thing, much less tiring than a wristy action oo-er :p)
I'm actually drawing the way it tells me to in the book. I sit down in a chair, lean my board onto another chair in front of me, hunch over it, and draw away.
It's not comfortable at all, and I'd much rather draw while standing up. But I don't have an easel at the moment, and I want to follow the book pretty closely (to a point anyway), so I don't have much choice right now. Once I get the chance though, like when I start getting good enough to go outside and practice, it'll be the first thing I do.
zacharias on 24/6/2013 at 06:00
Doesn't sound comfortable at all to me, especially the hunched part. I wouldn't follow the book too religiously if you are not comfortable (just read that bit again anyway, there's no mention of hunching in the book ;))
Regardless; the wrist thing is a separate thing. Don't think it is mentioned in the book. But more or less you should lock the wrist, except for big changes of direction; use the shoulder as the main pivot. Might feel odd at first but it gives you much force/versatility than wrist drawing.
One other thing I ran into with contour (doing the slow contours) was if i was miles away from the model it gets unsatisfactory (to me at least); you are spending 15 or 30 minutes and the model is across the room, you simply can't see them well enough. That's why i reckon going to a local park and sketching trees is arguably better (you can sit as close as you like to really see the contours in detail; it's also free :p).
Renzatic on 24/6/2013 at 06:14
Quote Posted by zacharias
Doesn't sound comfortable at all to me, especially the hunched part. I wouldn't follow the book too religiously if you are not comfortable (just read that bit again anyway, there's no mention of hunching in the book ;))
It's not, and you're right. I read through that part of the book again, and it says to "lean forward". But hell...that's just a euphemism for hunching if you ask me. :P
Quote:
Regardless; the wrist thing is a separate thing. Don't think it is mentioned in the book. But more or less you should lock the wrist, except for big changes of direction; use the shoulder as the main pivot. Might feel odd at first but it gives you much force/versatility than wrist drawing.
I tried that just a little while ago, and it didn't feel all that weird. If anything, it was the opposite. It felt more natural. Thing is, it seems better suited to working on large pictures rather than the relatively smaller ones I'm doing. That might just be because I'm not practiced at it, but I feel like I want to use my wrist more for making tiny changes.
Though I'll say one of the major reasons why my arm hurts so much after doing these is because I bear down pretty hard while I'm drawing. It's like I'm concentrating so much it's being translated into my hand. Plus I'm pretty sure all this intense staring is gonna drive me into a pair of glasses before it's a;; done with.
Quote:
One other thing I ran into with contour (doing the slow contours) was if i was miles away from the model it gets unsatisfactory (to me at least); you are spending 15 or 30 minutes and the model is across the room, you simply can't see them well enough. That's why i reckon going to a local park and sketching trees is arguably better (you can sit as close as you like to really see the contours in detail; it's also free :p).
All I've done so far is draw my hand, which is about 2 feet away from my face (if that). I plan on going out and drawing some trees in my front yard tomorrow, so we'll see how that turns out.
But in the meantime....BACK TO THE GRIND!
edit: (
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3018396/Examples/Hands.JPG) I was impressed by how well these turned out. The one on the bottom right was done in one continuous line. The top left I did in three, and shaded it a bit.
Even after just three hours of tedious, mind numbing, constant, unceasing practice, I can already see a slight improvement.
But whatever you think of it, (
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3018396/Examples/Hand.JPG) it's definitely nicer than the ones I was doing yesterday.
Nicker on 24/6/2013 at 09:07
Quote Posted by Renzatic
Though I'll say one of the major reasons why my arm hurts so much after doing these is because I bear down pretty hard while I'm drawing. It's like I'm concentrating so much it's being translated into my hand. Plus I'm pretty sure all this intense staring is gonna drive me into a pair of glasses before it's a;; done with.
I think you are making very good progress. Was that finger for SubJeff?
If you are bearing down hard to get a dark line your medium may be too hard. Try 3, 4 or 5 B softness in conte (or pencils if you insist) or get some charcoal. It also makes it easier to change the weight of the line more easily, giving you more expression with less brawn.
Also try taping your drawing paper to the wall or a door, before you invest in an easel, to see if you like standing up. Drawing at arm's length will be easier on your eyes too. But you definitely should avoid hunching over. I think it gets you back into that elementary school mindset where you are trying to please teacher by producing nicely formed letters and colouring inside the lines.
Renzatic on 27/6/2013 at 06:11
Quote Posted by Nicker
I think you are making very good progress. Was that finger for SubJeff?
No, that would've been a middle finger. It's coming soon. :mad:
Quote:
If you are bearing down hard to get a dark line your medium may be too hard. Try 3, 4 or 5 B softness in conte (or pencils if you insist) or get some charcoal. It also makes it easier to change the weight of the line more easily, giving you more expression with less brawn.
Like I said previously, my biggest problem is I start bearing down when I'm over concentrating. When I do the blind contours, they start out nice and light, and the farther into the line I go, the deeper I stare (and squint, cuz I'm closing one eye), and harder I press with the pencil.
Though using some padding probably would help a bit. My drawing board isn't exactly soft, and I'm using regular No.2 pencils for all this (I do have some graphite bars, but I haven't used them yet). Next time I'm out near the art store, I'll pick up some different kinds of pencils (and maybe some contes, they sound fancy), and see if that helps me at all.
Quote:
Also try taping your drawing paper to the wall or a door, before you invest in an easel, to see if you like standing up. Drawing at arm's length will be easier on your eyes too. But you definitely should avoid hunching over. I think it gets you back into that elementary school mindset where you are trying to please teacher by producing nicely formed letters and colouring inside the lines.
It'll make you happy to know that I've started practicing drawing from the shoulder rather than my wrist. It actually does make life a little easier on me. A little bit.
Also, I've started gesture drawing today. It's kinda weird because I watched through a ton of videos, not thinking I'd be able to do it at all. My first two attempts only seemed to back that fact up. Then it was like something clicked, and I started being able to do them surprisingly well. I found this website that flashes a model onscreen for 90 seconds before changing poses. I went through 15 of them, each one better than the last, before I decided to take a break. It's actually the most fun I've had drawing.
They're kinda primitive art looking, (
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3018396/Examples/Gesture_Drawings.jpg) but you can actually tell what they are (here's your titties, Duck!). The proportions and everything are just about perfect on them. I never thought I'd be able to make a drawing like that, simple or not, in just 90 seconds. Yet here I am, flying through them.
I can see why the slow contour drawings are so important now. It makes you pay more attention to curves and outlines, and helps train your hand to follow your eye.
edit: Also did yet another hand. Same thing as before. It's a blind contour, so things didn't come out 100% right, but it's pretty good.
Inline Image:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3018396/Examples/New_Hand.jpgSubJeff on 27/6/2013 at 06:15
Quote Posted by Nicker
If you are bearing down hard
he is i can tell didnt i explain this already
COI: I only draw stick men with lazer pistols
Renzatic on 27/6/2013 at 06:35
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
COI: I only draw stick men with lazer pistols
Lazer pistols are fucking rad. Wish I could draw a lazer pistol. :(
SubJeff on 27/6/2013 at 08:53
They are made of two lines.
The handle.
And the barrel.
Renzatic on 27/6/2013 at 08:58
No way, man. That's a revolver.
