SD on 14/3/2006 at 22:07
Oh you guys.
I said it was compelling, I didn't say it was totally believable.
Jonesy on 14/3/2006 at 22:18
Which is easier to believe, StD, that the US government, through inefficient systems, bad management and poor inter-agency coordination let 9-11 happen, or that the US government successfully took two jet airliners, rammed them into two large buildings in the heart of the one of the world's most populous cities, placed and detonated c-4 in and around said buildings in order for them to collapse, and additionally caused two other jet airliners to vanish, one into Cleveland, and the other to god knows where? Oh, and we fired a missile into our own key military center.
This is the UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT we're talking about. They can't even deliver the mail properly, you suddenly expect them to perpetrate one of the most heinous acts of terrorism on their own citizens without somebody leaking the details?
Malygris on 14/3/2006 at 22:19
Quote Posted by Loose Change
We will gladly send a free DVD to anybody who lost friends or family on September 11th, 2001
Since it sounds like you're not going to watch it, can I have your copy?
Paz on 14/3/2006 at 22:25
Still, that passport find was pretty laffo.
Oli G on 14/3/2006 at 22:30
Edit - just to clarify and avoid causing offense, the following rant is targeted at the documentary and its makers, not std.
I might watch the whole thing when I have time, but having just seen the introduction sequence it looks extremely suspect. Lots of 'facts' without any indication of their provenance, plenty of quotations shown out of context and any number of coincidences which only appear suspicious because of the painfully biased way they're presented.
The idea that the US government carried out the September 11th attacks, or that it knew about them but did nothing, is utter bollocks.
As with any conspiracy theory there are going to be responses to this from two types of people: people who believe it, and people who have sense. Aside from the fact that there's no evidence to support this theory (if there was anything shocking and concrete I'm sure they'd have used it to hook me in the introduction - they didn't) there aren't even the basics like a motive to give this idea even a shade of credibility. What on earth would the US government gain by murdering several thousand of its own people? And whatever you might think of the Bush administration, how on earth can anyone seriously believe that it would be capable - and desirous - of doing this?
There's plenty to criticse regarding US policy and 9/11 - the complete failure in intelligence and the ineffective aircraft/airport security - but taking the conpiracy line is a particularly ghoulish and unhelpful way to approach things. I have to say the dedication to the victims which begins the documentary is downright cynical and reprehensible, given that the purpose of the film is not to commemorate but to sell the viewpoint of the people behind it.
It seems pretty clear that the film was fuelled by resentment towards the actions of the Bush administration after 9/11. Fabricating conspiracy theories like this, though, seriously undermines attempts to criticise the US government legitimately. The BBC documentary series The Power Of Nightmares (do a search, I think there was a thread on this) on the other hand did a fantastic job of setting 9/11 in a context of US governmental duplicity without straying into the kind of fairyland populated by fake moon landings and Elvis.
So, in short, what a lot of crap - but as I said, you're either susceptible to this kind of thing or you aren't.
BEAR on 14/3/2006 at 23:12
Btw, what happened to that 9/11 video that came out a little while ago, was short. Had cool music, basically was saying that what hit the pentagon wasnt a passenger plane or somthing, I cant remember enough of it to search, anyone know what Im talking about?
SD on 14/3/2006 at 23:16
It might well be this one, Bearicus dear ;)
broken on 14/3/2006 at 23:19
Quote Posted by Dia
OMG, broken. I am so very sorry. In no way did I mean to sound insensitive or flippant. My condolences and sympathy.
oh, please, dia, you didn't sound insensitive. thank you for your understanding.
it's just odd. when i think i've finally come to terms with it, i realize how little progress i've actually made. :(
BEAR on 14/3/2006 at 23:39
Also, about the video. I usually am against most conspiracy theories, in that I don't think that most of the people that allegedly perpetrate these things have the brains to keep it secret when they cant even keep stupid shit secret. But, you gotta admit there is just too much shit that doesn't add up, something isn't right here.
I'm usually the one getting pissed when I hear my hippy parents saying that bush is the anti-christ and that they caused 9/11 and they want to bla bla bla. But, there is alot of weird shit in this. I think some people are just crazy enough to do this, but I just dont know if I trust that they are actually competent enough to pull it off. Talk to anyone in the air force or other branches of the armed forces, you cant keep shit secret, even dumb shit that they really want to keep under wraps, and this would be a doozy.
