TTLG dead as anything other than forums?

jay pettitt on 10/5/2007 at 07:58

The trouble with a news page is that it needs people to love and care for it all the time, it would seem that the forums and micro-sites soak up all that love; and seeing as that's where the action is that's probably how it should be. The status quo is that the hub page is dead and anyone passing by might not notice that there is an aging, yet eclectic, community of hasbeen gamers being ~~bitchy~~ all super intelligent and insightful just a few clicks away. As has already been mentioned TTLG is primarily about intelligent game talk, EuroGamer does game news far better than we ever could or might want to.

If it were up to me I'd kill the hub page altogether and direct folks straight to the forums (or a snapshot of the significant parts there of such as Stitch suggests and possibly minus Comm Chat because of the colourful/cliquesqueish nature of the discourse). If there's news to tell it's probably told in the forums as well as anywhere. Then I'd make the micro-sites more prominent in a clever sort of way from the forum pages.

If anything I'd try and angle TTLG towards being a bit smaller/tighter rather than planning on biggering it.

If we really want a news page/site/hub perhaps the micro-sites could hari-kiri themselves into archiveland and their various roles converge collectively towards front of shop.

-edit-
all that said the FM culture is awesome. It's a shame it's hidden away so.

Hemebond on 10/5/2007 at 08:30

* Take off and nuke the hub from orbit. The forums/community are what I think of when I think of TTLG.* Merge the child sites into one with customisable RSS feeds so users can filter out what they don't want.* Turn TTLG into a proper little network with child sites as sub-domains/sub-paths (e.g., ttlg.com/forums ttlg.com/thief ttlg.com/systemshock). Change the child sites to have a standardised (though customised) format and organisation.* Keep TTLG focused. Don't try to replace or compete with other news/community sites. If I want hardware reviews I'll go to a site that focuses on hardware. Otherwise it'll dilute and muddy what TTLG is about.* TTLG is primarily, at least to me, about a few core games; games that dictate or influence the introduction of other games.* The addition of community-related features or web apps based around these games. As suggested by (http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1592272#post1592272) Firefreak, calendars; chatrooms (#systemshock has almost no connection to TTLG despite the efforts of some members); file repositories; mod and editor resources and documentation.* I guess I'm seeing something similar to the planet*.com sites, but based around a few core games only; with additional similar games pressed against the boundaries, living loosely within the framework.

Briareos H on 10/5/2007 at 08:54

I wonder how many people think that the hub should be removed. As for me, I'd like to see it live again with community news as much as with random "grownup" contributions. Set up an easy CMS, empower selected members of the community who are willing to write news or features on the front hub and let everything happen.

And I certainly don't think that the content should be restricted to videogaming. What I really want to see is a CMS-ed version of the TTLG cookbook, Gingerbread Man's guide for homebrewers with pictures, random photoshopping contests, etc. all with a link to the corresponding topic on the forums.

Oh, and of course, serious news sometimes.

Kolya on 10/5/2007 at 09:38

I think you'd need some sort of communication eg a comments feature for articles on the main site as the heart is a forum and it strikes me as odd when it's sole people posting their view on the hub. TTLG is a smart mob, not so much single outstanding talents and that should be made use of.

Firefreak on 10/5/2007 at 10:56

Quote Posted by Briareos H

And I certainly don't think that the content should be restricted to videogaming. What I really want to see is a CMS-ed version of the TTLG cookbook, Gingerbread Man's guide for homebrewers with pictures, random photoshopping contests, etc. all with a link to the corresponding topic on the forums.

That is some idea I can imagine. A community site with various topics according to interests. Calendar functions for the next meeting. Contests... and the main theme (the red line of the site complex) are 'intelligent' games to lure new people.

But, somehow I always immediately see both sides of the coin. How 'different' would this new TTLG then be from (subgroups at) actual social network sites (e.g. myspace)?

Are we actually discussing two questions:

* What should TTLG be (mainly) about? The red line like intelligent games
* In what format should it be presented? CMS, Forum only, News, wiki, ...

Schattentänzer on 10/5/2007 at 11:41

I'd advice not to try too hard to figure out what TTLG is or isn't or should or shouldn't be. That will only lead to headaches.

Maybe it would be more helpful to think about what you want to achieve with a new front page? Do you want to make it a portal for potential new members? Do you want to offer a service for the existing community? Do you want to create something new altogether?

I think it's a bit premature to discuss possible content if the purpose is still hazy.

HybridVision on 10/5/2007 at 13:21

Trouble with news sites is that they need multiple, daily entries to be useful.

Personally I'd be more inclined to turn it into a useful informative resource, giving info which is not mirrored elsewhere.

Now, one idea which may or may not work, and something which I don't already see out in the world wide wibble, is a resource to track devs and their movements. Which games they were involved with, and what they're doing now.

Maybe some sort of timeline, with classics such as Thief, SShock, the birth and death of various game studios. All that info congregated as an educational resource for anyone looking for a great game they might have missed.

I mean, Home of the Underdogs is great and all, but it doesn't often tell you who was involved on a project, such that if you particularly liked the graphics in game A, you could find other titles that artist was involved in.

I don't know how you'd present all that info, but it's certainly something I'd take time to read. Being able to trace a game's ancestry, relate it to other projects, find who made it and what they went on to do... to me that's interesting. And it could help people find great games they otherwise might not.

That's about all I can think of :/

Judith on 10/5/2007 at 14:46

Quote Posted by jay pettitt

All that said the FM culture is awesome. It's a shame it's hidden away so.

You can always see recent FM news on The Circle, can you? I'm not a frequent visitor there, because I'm used to going straight to the proper section of this forum, but I thought their infos about fan missions were more or less up to date...

Actually it's hard to find the main hub's role without copying someone else's ideas, when it comes to games. Maybe if we were more like online gaming community (see The Older Gamers for comparison) it might have any sense.

jay pettitt on 10/5/2007 at 15:21

New releases get announced, but last time I looked there was not a lot of extra supporting info. The reviews fizzled away and died a few years ago, there's no glossy screen shots etc etc. If you're casually interested and pass by once in a while like myself there's not a lot there to help you pick a cool Fan Mission to play of an evening.

Gingerbread Man on 10/5/2007 at 15:25

Quote Posted by Schattentänzer

I think it's a bit premature to discuss possible content if the purpose is still hazy.

This is true. Although sometimes discussion of content ends up sketching out a unified structure. But yeah, I know what you're saying.

So what are the potential, useful purposes for the hub? A news portal seems redundant and kinda 1998, and as I said before it ends up with the front page being skipped for bookmarks deeper in the network. It'd be one thing if you were interested in getting news updates from multiple sites and felt it easier to bookmark the portal, but a) RSS feeds and b) we don't really have ongoing news from multiple sites at the moment.

This is a community of grown-ups, by and large. Sure, there are plenty of teenagers (and many on the young side of teen at that) but for the most part it's the attitude and expectations which are "grown-up" -- there's been no cry for a Halo forum, no petitions started to include WoW or Second Life or whatever else is popular today that for whatever reason doesn't seem to fit.

And yes, we are strongly attached to the legacy games in a big way. PigLick's comments are bang on the money in that regard. At the moment we manage to pretty artfully straddle the old-school and the new-school... albeit in whatever inexpressible manner lends us to favour Certain Types of Games over others.

Maybe it is a fruitless venture to define this TTLGenre. Maybe it's better for us to keep on scouting and hunting out the games as we do... developing a reputation for game appreciation based on quality and maturity instead of genre definitions or other narrowly-constructed criteria is probably a great idea. The only time it really throws a spanner is when someone asks us to define the qualities we look for, and all we can do is try to find a way to say "I dunno... Good games, games that don't suck... Games that take some kind of intelligence to appreciate" without sounding like horrible snobs.

My feeling is that the main hub needs to be (conceptually and in content) something that creates the cohesion that doesn't seem to be there now. We don't need to ape existing sites or try to do someone else's job better than they do -- and we shouldn't try. If people wanted Gamespy, they'd go to Gamespy. Same goes for Quarter to Three.

One thing we aren't interested in doing is scrapping the main hub entirely. The fact that some people (even occasionally me included) think it should be set on fire and dumped into the ocean is entirely the result of the hub being what it is right now. It seems useless because we aren't using it. We aren't looking for a way to justify keeping it around, we're looking for a way to make it into (essentially) a worthwhile and interesting part of the larger TTLG community.