DarkThief Darek on 2/12/2017 at 01:57
Quote Posted by Nameless Voice
I once built an AI suspiciousness system for a campaign (that never got far), where guards would notice all manner of suspicious things, from rope/moss arrows and flares, to doors left open, to loot missing, to guards missing, etc., and each time they would make note of it and gain "suspicion points". Once they had noticed enough suspicious things, they would not only go on alert, but would head to the guardroom and organise a room-to-room search of the entire building, including specifically searching obvious hiding-places such as inside cupboards and inside fireplaces.
Interesting. I always love seeing advanced stuff with the Thief AI. Thanks for the link, I really need to look at your awesome work! :)
Though I never scripted in Thief myself I heavily modified my T2 gamesys to make the guards smarter and tougher - and in turn a bit more realistic. Guards can see you from further away and your footsteps makes louder sound when you run (regardless of the underground - thanks to the Ultimate Difficulty Mod)
Also, I heavily experienced with the sword fighting capabilities from the guards. Seriously, the melee AIs in general are weak as hell and can't swing with the sword when they don't stand directly in front of you. It's another point being less realistic. You can run around guards or run past them if they caught you, but if you don't stand still they won't even attempt to swing at you with their weapon. I wish the guards can tackle you down like in real life if you try to run past them. Stay away and hide is the idea, but the punishment is if far too weak.
IAmTheWalrus on 16/12/2017 at 15:01
Deadly Shadows was originally going to have shadow detection. I believe there's still code in the folders. Hell, I think I even remember a possibly of there being a way to enable it in-game. Those last two points I'm not sure of, though.
It's also amazing how well darkness can hide you. I was in a room with no emanating light besides lots coming through from the room it leads into and when I went in a bit my mate couldn't see me at all. It was weird since I was right there I almost didn't believe him, but when he did it even trying to see him I couldn't. When there's no silhouette hiding in darkness seems to be very easy, even with lots of light coming through.
I'd argue that the original Splinter Cell has far more realism in its stealth. I couldn't stand the game and found its stealth to be annoyingly inconsistent as well as its level design terrible, but you have to be really, really slow on any surface to remain quiet. Also you get away with far less. If you're even a little bit visible and a guard is a few feet away he will spot you instantly. From my experience with the game anyway.
IAmTheWalrus on 16/12/2017 at 15:03
Also Thief 1 and 2 do have a slight silhouette system. It's a rare occurence, but I have noticed enough times where if the wall is lit but the surrounding walls aren't or the floor isn't or whatever, you are visible. E.g. light coming through a window in an otherwise pitch black room.
DarkThief Darek on 17/12/2017 at 13:15
Quote Posted by IAmTheWalrus
Also Thief 1 and 2 do have a slight silhouette system. It's a rare occurence, but I have noticed enough times where if the wall is lit but the surrounding walls aren't or the floor isn't or whatever, you are visible. E.g. light coming through a window in an otherwise pitch black room.
In Thief 1 and 2 it only matters if your center is in the light. Your feet could still stand in darkness, but if your stomach gets hit by light, you will be visible. You can see this the best with spot light pointing down. You can walk a little in the light cone without getting visible.
What also is a heavy factor in realism stealth is how well your eyes are adapted to the darkness. If they are, you can see pretty much in complete darkness, but you have to avoid lit areas, because you can get blinded easily and lose the dark view.
And if your eyes are used to lit areas you see only pitch black in the darkness.
But I guess implementing this in a game would be really annoying, because you have to always wait for your eyes to adapt and the AIs would be far more unreliable in what they can see and what they can't see.
PinkDot on 17/12/2017 at 15:58
I wonder if this had been used in any game before - a microphone active during the game. So, if you cough or sneeze, the guards will hear it! Or if you roar and scream you might scare some kind of creature and made it runaway - that's to avoid a combat. Could be hilarious sometimes. :)
Yandros on 17/12/2017 at 18:00
Quote Posted by IAmTheWalrus
Also Thief 1 and 2 do have a slight silhouette system. It's a rare occurence, but I have noticed enough times where if the wall is lit but the surrounding walls aren't or the floor isn't or whatever, you are visible. E.g. light coming through a window in an otherwise pitch black room.
This is a faulty interpretation of events, there is no silhouette system in Dark. Player visibility to the AI is 100% governed by the light gem, which in turn is governed by whether or not your midsection (which is where the Player object is) is illuminated.
muzboz on 7/2/2018 at 22:00
Quote Posted by Grandmauden
Well, the first thing that jumps into my mind is silhouettes. Even if I'm in the darkest shadow possible when a guard is looking in my direction, if there's a light source behind me and I'm blocking at least part of that light, the guard could easily realize someone is standing there.
However, I've never seen Thief, or any other stealth games (to my knowledge), take silhouettes into account. But that's a good thing, IMO, because otherwise, it'd be too frustrating and unfair for players. Imagine how difficult the games would become if light sources could give you away even without directly illuminating you! Even the first tutorial in "A Keeper's Training" would probably be impossible if the Keeper instructor acknowledged your silhouette.
I'm working on AI in Unity currently, and hoping to make something quite Thiefy one day. I have a basic stealth system going, but still need to add in a proper search behaviour, have guards communicate to each other, etc.
I was thinking that I would try to put in the silhouette checking, as well, so players really had to hide in dark areas that aren't backed by a light wall behind them, etc. I think it'd work well, so long as the level design made sure to provide these sorts of spaces.
Also, the guards would need specific voice lines for when they detect you this way, to provide the player with feedback about why they have been seen... I'm not sure how one would slip that into conversation without it sounding awkward!?
"I see you against the light!"
"I see a silhouette over here!"