downwinder on 17/5/2023 at 18:17
how do you come up with a thief 5 when there was no thief 4,please explain that to me anyone
thief 2014 was a reboot, not the same garrett , different basso, gwenivear is a bird, please stop
zomfg1234 on 17/5/2023 at 18:49
Quote Posted by downwinder
how do you come up with a thief 5 when there was no thief 4,please explain that to me anyone
thief 2014 was a reboot, not the same garrett , different basso, gwenivear is a bird, please stop
Well, that is another problem because Thief 2014 was called Thief 4 by pretty much everyone except the devs themselves, so if you make actual Thief 4, it would be extremely confusing and would collide with everyone's already ingrained thoughts. What do you mean Thief 4 is coming out? It came out in 2014 - is what would an average gamer say. That's hell for marketing. But then if you make another Thief, you definitely want to have a follow-up on the trilogy, not the reboot, so you can't call it Thief 5 either, it's not a sequel to (unofficial) 4. I mean, the devs and the publisher really fucked it up with the whole reboot but not really thing.
The next Thief would have to be named Thief: something, like with God of War: Ragnarok. It's technically GoW5, but also GoW2 based on their own new vision as to what that series should be. Hence you won't see God of War title with any number ever again. The same would happen to Thief, if it was to be made. Things like that is why I think the series won't be resurrected ever again. Too much stuff that went wrong, and too much stuff that is too difficult to execute and won't bring big returns. Fanmissions are more than enough for me, so I don't mind.
Cigam on 18/5/2023 at 16:50
Quote Posted by downwinder
how do you come up with a thief 5 when there was no thief 4,please explain that to me anyone
Surely it is common practise to give the latest entry in a franchise a working title that ends with the installment number, irrespective of how the latest installment ends up fitting (or not fitting) within the previous installments' timelines / stories?
For example, don't they initially use the working title James Bond #n for the next James Bond film. Even if, as with Casino Royale, it ends up being a reboot and not James Bond #23.
So anyway, you should interpret Thief 5 as meaning the 5th game made in the overall Thief franchise, and not necessarily as intending to mean the 4th direct sequel to the first game.
Cigam on 18/5/2023 at 17:48
Also, while Thief 2014 was a reboot and not a direct sequel, you could just about call it a continuation of earlier Thief as it does continue the storylines (a little bit).
Even though it is set in a new "cycle" of the city decades or centuries later, you can learn through historical documents that (for example) Edwina Moira, after losing her husband and going a little mad for a while, later founded the Moira Asylum. A place that the original Garrett spent time in as an inmate, and for some reason his mechanical eye was left behind there.
We can also learn that the Hammerite and Keeper Orders declined, and all that is left are old ruins of their former buildings.
So Thief 2014 does not represent a complete severance from the characters / stories of the originals.
Who knows if Thief 5 (if it ever appears) will also maintain some level of continuity with the earlier games. And so the 5 could represent both the 5th installment in the Thief IP franchise, as well as the 5th game to have some level of continuity with the original characters / events.
Azaran on 18/5/2023 at 18:59
What I foresee some day is some kind of spiritual successor to Thief, along the lines of Dishonored but with more stealth and thievery emphasis.
Cutpurse: The Tenebrous Project
Cutpurse 2: The Metal Era
Cutpurse 3: Pernicious Gloom
New Horizon on 18/5/2023 at 19:47
Quote Posted by zomfg1234
Well, that is another problem because Thief 2014 was called Thief 4 by pretty much everyone except the devs themselves, so if you make actual Thief 4, it would be extremely confusing and would collide with everyone's already ingrained thoughts. What do you mean Thief 4 is coming out? It came out in 2014 - is what would an average gamer say. That's hell for marketing. But then if you make another Thief, you definitely want to have a follow-up on the trilogy, not the reboot, so you can't call it Thief 5 either, it's not a sequel to (unofficial) 4. I mean, the devs and the publisher really fucked it up with the whole reboot but not really thing.
The next Thief would have to be named Thief: something, like with God of War: Ragnarok. It's technically GoW5, but also GoW2 based on their own new vision as to what that series should be. Hence you won't see God of War title with any number ever again. The same would happen to Thief, if it was to be made. Things like that is why I think the series won't be resurrected ever again. Too much stuff that went wrong, and too much stuff that is too difficult to execute and won't bring big returns. Fanmissions are more than enough for me, so I don't mind.
The dev team did call it Thief 4 when the plan was to be a direct sequel. They had a logo and website thief4.com but the team had a lot of creative turnover, so the final game was not what they originally started out with.
downwinder on 18/5/2023 at 20:07
thief 2014 took place in a alt universe, nothing to do with thief 1-3 as far as story
and yes i remember the thi4f logo, but new horizon said it best above
Cigam on 18/5/2023 at 21:31
Quote Posted by downwinder
thief 2014 took place in a alt universe, nothing to do with thief 1-3 as far as story
Well I think that the in-game evidence says otherwise. The Thief 2014 universe has a back history of some of the same specific characters and events, and even ruins of the exact same buildings that we visited in the earlier games.
Not to mention the same themes of the City having "cycles" of being built over itself. In Thief 2014 there is the part where Garrett is travelling deep underground, sees the different layers of architectural ruins and comments 'Each city built upon the bones of the last. If they could talk, I wonder what they'd say'. Which continues the theme of that guard discussion in Thief DS about how no-one knows how old the city is, how many times it has been built over, not the Hammerites, not anyone.
Everything points towards this being set in the future of the previous games, with this being a new cycle of the city that was built over the previous one we knew.
I suspect that you only don't want to believe that it is the same universe because a certain doll is not mentioned :)
downwinder on 18/5/2023 at 22:00
^alt universe, it just how they did it, but not connected to thief 1-3 universe
thief 2014 is set 200 years ahead of thief series in a alt universe, even with names the same and building it not the same universe as we all know of garrett
but of course i see all your points but as far as cannon thief 2014 is not the same as thief 1-3
retelling of thief basically
and dewdrop was never part of any of my thoughts as thief 3 did not have dewdrop and i was ok with that,i would never let dewdrop make me change thief cannon
zomfg1234 on 21/5/2023 at 01:59
Quote Posted by New Horizon
The dev team did call it Thief 4 when the plan was to be a direct sequel. They had a logo and website thief4.com but the team had a lot of creative turnover, so the final game was not what they originally started out with.
I get that, they did intend for it to be a direct sequel, I think the whole reboot thing came very late actually, near the very end, because if you remember they contacted Stephen Russell to reprise Garrett. They probably decided to spin it as something other than a sequel only after the changes and problems they encountered (remember that it had a lot of development issues and staff changes).
