Thief (4) Features. What we know is in, what we know is out.

SubJeff on 22/4/2013 at 14:48

Quote Posted by Dia

I agree Springheel... ...in the first two games may have been simplistic, at least you're still in the environment and can see/hear the guards coming which adds to the immersion and tension.

I've just explained how they are the same. Being sucked in is a different issue - the lock picking mechanic is still the same.

Dia on 22/4/2013 at 14:55

Yeah Vivian, my bad; probably Oblivion. I only played TDS once (well, one & a half times - couldn't stand the torture very long the 2nd time around) so my memory is rather murky. I still didn't like the lockpicking system in TDS, though. Even less than I liked the idiot doing the VO in that video. But thanks for the reminder.

Renault on 22/4/2013 at 14:58

For TDS, if you install The Minimalist Project, you can rid yourself of the lame lockpicking graphic, and rely solely on sound and Garrett's hands. It makes for the best lockpicking experience of the three games (and I'll include TDM in that as well). There's something satisfying about finding the "sweet spot" as opposed to just choosing a lockpick and waiting until it's done is job.

SubJeff on 22/4/2013 at 15:04

It looks like it'd be good but the sweet spot hunt is an illusion - there are only the cardinal points of the compass to select from so it's actually much less skilful than it appears.

Dia on 22/4/2013 at 15:12

Thanks for the tip, Brethren. But I have no intentions to revisit TDS. Aside from all the other aspects of the game that I found seriously disappointing (just my opinion here, mind you), I'd end up having to revisit .......

The Cradle.

'Nuff said.

Renault on 22/4/2013 at 15:17

Quote Posted by Subjective Effect

It looks like it'd be good but the sweet spot hunt is an illusion

No, it's not. You have to find the correct position out of 8 possibilities. How is that an illusion? I don't want 16 or 32, that's too complicated and time intensive. And it's much more engaging than just choosing a pick and waiting until it's finished.

I remember using the mouse for lockpicking in TDS - do we know for sure you can use arrow keys or WASD?

SubJeff on 22/4/2013 at 15:27

Because you can move with the mouse it looks like the spot could be anywhere when in fact it's only the points of a compass that are possibilities, hence me saying it's an illusion. I was disappointed when I realised how easy it was and how it's really no different to the old method.

Yes you can use wasd. I did. But I already told you that.

slavatrumpevitch on 22/4/2013 at 16:12

The lockpicking mechanics *are* indeed different.

In T1/2 the only time differential between an expert player, and a novice player is how many seconds the novice spends fumbling thru their inventory. (this is probably pretty close to 0 seconds, once you become half-way decent; the exception of course being The Sepulchre of Sinistral, where for whatever reason, the lockpicks are not adjacent in the inventory)

But in T3, a veteran player can open the lock substantially faster. This is b/c in t3, there is no hard-wired 'waiting time' at any point during the process. However, in t1/2 probably 99% of the time is spent merely waiting.

This is (potentially) important from a gameplay perspective, because sometimes speedy picking is essential.

EDIT: Sadly, TDS didn't really take advantage of this difference very well. It would have been cool if they had situations where only a very quick lock-picker could make it thru somewhere without alerting guards. (maybe to get one of the coveted 'special loot items')

Springheel on 22/4/2013 at 16:40

Quote:

You use the wasd keys to choose the direction you pick. It does the clicky thing, you move on.

Even if you use the keys (I never did, and I'm not sure how you get the diagonal spots if you do), you still have to listen for the indicator that you've found the right location and hit the attack key (or whatever key it was). You actually have to pay attention. I suppose you could just hold down the attack key and keep spamming buttons until everything finally opens, but even then, the length of time it takes to open the lock is still based on your decisions and ability/inability to recognize the lock design. There is nothing similar to that in T1/2.

Quote:

It still follows the same method - select operator, listen for click que, wait for outcome, repeat.

Yes, I suppose if you break things down far enough, they become the same. Both sex and food follow the same pattern too: select satiating object, prepare it for use, select any necessary tools, engage in satiating activity until satisfied, clean up.

However, if you went off on someone who claimed that sex and food were different, people might look at you strangely.

SubJeff on 22/4/2013 at 16:55

You still have to look and listen for the indicator that you have the right pick in Thief 1. You don't need to break this down so far as you're suggesting I have. Sex and food share only the briefest of functional similarities in comparison to how alike the picking mechanics are.

As for diagonals - have you ever tried pursuing two keys at once? You should, you can get things like capital letters and everything!