Thief 1/2 & SShock 2: DDFix and Enhanced Resolution Patch - discussion

Hiatus on 2/4/2008 at 08:25

Timeslip

I re-d/led updated beta (.1) and replaced that core_2\patio.pcx texture from 1st mission (with some random 1024x1024 tga I found on the web). Here is the result (with tga resized to 512x512 - similar effect with original 1024x1024 and, what is worrying, 256x256). Besides, the higher the size, the stronger/more visible texture aliasing (@1024x1024 it's really massive).

Q to make sure: after I patch .pcx to replace, do I have to re-patch it if I change replacement .tga *contents* somehow (i.e. resize it - no name change)? Or once patched is ok in that case?

here's the result (.tga 512x512 used):

(http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/9822/screenshot3hd4.png)

hmm... doesn't look like original tga at all :confused:? what are these dark vertical stripes?

here's original low res 64x64 .pcx:

(http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8181/screenshot1mq0.png)

... here is original texture I grabbed and used (I used middle one I think):

(http://www.katsbits.com/htm/textures/kt_ground1024.htm)

more here:

(http://www.katsbits.com/htm/textures.htm)

===

tried diff. level and .pcx and similar results (start of Framed mission, replaced \core_1\Cobls1.pcx) with 512x512 .tga:

(http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/7901/screenshot4mt4.png)

Nameless Voice on 2/4/2008 at 08:54

Excellent work as always, Timeslip!

I'm a bit wary about overriding the original textures with 'nonsense', though, as that means that any upgraded world texture pack will break the game if you're not running DDFix.
I don't suppose there's some way that you could override the files, yet still keep the originals there for when DDFix is not running?

Hiatus on 2/4/2008 at 11:08

Timeslip

don't know if you are aware of it but letting you know just in case:

pixelated door bug (present in 1.0/1.1 but NOT in 1.2) is back (at least to some extent) in latest beta (.1). Here's an example (Framed, 1st door on the right at start of the level):

1st, vanilla T2 (door text seems ok/properly filtered):
(http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/8562/dump000wn5.png)

ddfix 1.27 (door tex seems ok/properly filtered):
(http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/7410/screenshot1lg5.png)

latest beta ddfix (more pixelated now):
(http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/6417/screenshot2mk6.png)

It's not that severe as in 1.0/1.1 AFAIR but still there's a noticeable visual difference between the two.
Not aware of any other issues/regressions (if any) as I didn't test it for longer than 1 minute but this one I've noticed right away...

===

Quote:

Textures are now correctly freed from system memory at the end of each level

now that's *very* nice :thumb:!

Quote Posted by Timeslip

Think it's worth moving this 32 bit texture discussion to the editors guild forum?

probably yes, though I'm not sure if it is now (with this feature still being in fast-changing beta/incomplete etc). But once it stabilizes a bit (even if still in beta) then I think it would be worthwhile moving it out to more fitting section where more people would test it. PM mods in any case - I'm sure they'll be helpful.

inselaffe on 2/4/2008 at 14:32

Quote Posted by sNeaksieGarrett

Actually, thief is not capped, unless you have V-Sync on.

Hmm I didn't know you could turn v-sync on for thief - unless ddfix does this automatically?

It's not on in my video card drivers by default, cos i get tearing in my other games. I can't actually access the catalyst control centre because it refuses to run - reinstalling doesn't help and I actually broke my drivers once doing that :P So yer my computer is in limbo till i reinstall windows ;)

Nameless Voice on 2/4/2008 at 15:31

You should try going into device manager and 'deleting' you graphics card device, then rebooting and reinstalling the drivers. I had to do that recently when installing newer (admittedly nVIDIA) drivers, since the control panel broke until I did.

Otherwise, you could try using the (http://www.omegadrivers.net/) Omega Drivers for your Radeon.

Timeslip on 2/4/2008 at 17:25

Quote Posted by Hiatus

here's the result (.tga 512x512 used):

(http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/9822/screenshot3hd4.png)

hmm... doesn't look like original tga at all :confused:? what are these dark vertical stripes?

Those textures are 24 bit, but ddfix can only load 32 bit correctly at the moment. Will fix for .2.

Quote Posted by Nameless Voice

I'm a bit wary about overriding the original textures with 'nonsense', though, as that means that any upgraded world texture pack will break the game if you're not running DDFix.
I don't suppose there's some way that you could override the files, yet still keep the originals there for when DDFix is not running?

I can let you do it without replacing the original files as long as the .crf's are unpacked. In .2, whenever thief tries to open a .pcx file, ddfix tries to open a '.pcx.override' file first, so you can keep the original texture in place and put the modified one somewhere else. You can't just put the replacement texture there though because ddfix can't link the file to the texture at the time it's first opened; it gets copied around in memory a few times first. :(

Edit: Updated the beta again

Code:

GUI now creates new files with a .override extension instead of overwriting the original pcx
New file types supported for replacement textures. You can now use 24 or 32 bit tga's or bmp's.
Improved checking of .tga's so that ddfix doesn't try loading something it doesn't know how to
Fixed the sharpened textures issue that got reintroduced in 1.3

Edit 2: Another (http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/4825/screenshot1pc9.jpg) screenshot, showing one of Hiatus's broken textures loading properly this time. :)

Hiatus on 2/4/2008 at 18:57

Timeslip

wow, what can I say? Pure awesomeness :thumb:!

EDIT: and a couple of shots from me, to confirm it's working also on ATI:

(http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/5749/screenshot1zm7.png)
(http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/9615/screenshot2ra3.png)

ps Timeslip, what about texture aliasing, esp. visible in the distance/with certain angles, when moving etc? Is it possible to reduce/eliminate it somehow? And what causes it in the 1st place? Are all texture format/filtering methods similarly susceptible to it? I'd like to understand this phenomenon better (and how to fight it)..

Calibrator on 2/4/2008 at 20:07

Quote Posted by Hiatus

wow, what can I say? Pure awesomeness :thumb:!

EDIT: and a couple of shots from me:

(http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/5749/screenshot1zm7.png)
(http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/9615/screenshot2ra3.png)

This looks like a friggin' blood transfusion to me! :wot:

I can already see it: "This Thief 2 fan mission requires a 512MB graphics card."

:ebil:

Calibrator

Timeslip on 2/4/2008 at 20:11

Quote Posted by Hiatus

ps Timeslip, what about texture aliasing, esp. visible in the distance/with certain angles, when moving etc? Is it possible to reduce/eliminate it somehow? And what causes it in the 1st place? Are all texture format/filtering methods similarly susceptible to it? I'd like to understand this phenomenon better (and how to fight it)..

That happens if you try rendering something with the texels much smaller than the pixels. DX chooses from the texels under that pixel more or less at random, and moving your head slightly will cause it to choose a completely different texel.

mipmaps are designed to solve that problem, but because thief handles them manually under the assumption that the texture is still its original size it ends up using a texture that's a much higher resolution than it should be if you replace the original texture with something of a higher resolution. nvidia drivers have an option for forcing mipmaps: no idea what effect that will have on thief with its manual system, but it's worth a try if ATi have something similar. You can also just use textures that are the same size as what you're replacing, although that kind of defeats the point... I'm trying to fix it for .3 by overriding thief's mipmap handling stuff.

sNeaksieGarrett on 2/4/2008 at 22:32

Okay, getting way too technical guys.:p :cheeky: :confused: Anyhow, holy shit Hiatus, that floor texture looks insane!:eek:

Quote Posted by Dan Knott

Hmm I didn't know you could turn v-sync on for thief - unless ddfix does this automatically?

I'm not sure ddfix does, I think you could set it in 1.1.1?:confused: Anyway, I know in nvidia at least, you can set v-sync on or off yourself. Also, it is not just for thief, it is universal for any game, unless you do a "profile" for thief only.

EDIT: Okay, that's odd. I didn't think this got posted... There was some database error. =o TTLG would not load earlier.