Thief 1/2 & SShock 2: DDFix and Enhanced Resolution Patch - discussion - by bikerdude
bikerdude on 15/3/2008 at 21:07
Quote Posted by Nameless Voice
These two screenshots show the difference:
NV, could you take some before and after FOG shots and state what video card/s your using..?
thanks
biker
EvaUnit02 on 16/3/2008 at 06:32
Quote Posted by smithpd
I don't understand what DDFIX is supposed to do with Thief gold, since I never saw a problem with its rendering, other than it looks dated. What am I missing? Is it just the resolution switching for menus and books?
DDfix is almost the only way to get Dark engine games working on Nvidia cards (under XP at least) released from November 2007 onwards.
With the 8800GT you could use some shitty unoptimised, leaked beta XP32 driver (Forceware 167.76 IIRC), but with any later card you're completely stuffed without DDfix.
smithpd on 16/3/2008 at 06:37
I just swapped an x1950 Pro (Cat 8.1), which worked fine, for a 7950 GT. That also works perfectly. Sky, stars, fog, and no resolution change. Using driver 163.73.
EvaUnit32,
Thanks. I didn't realize that T1 was a problem. I am ready for the newer cards. :)
deathshadow on 16/3/2008 at 07:46
1.2.4 is working GREAT here except for one TINY little bug - it's so inconsequential I hate to even bring it up.
T2 now crashes on quitting the game... No big deal, you WANT to exit the program at that point anyways - but thought I should mention it. The specific error is:
The exception unknown software exception (0xc0000005) occured in the application at location 0x00183abc
System stats if it helps:
640 Meg Ge8800GTS, Q6600 OC'd to 2.7ghz, nForce 680i chipset mainboard, 4 gigs RAM, Audigy 2 ZS, XP x64 (there's also a 8400GS driving my secondary displays, but that shouldn't matter) - 169.21 on the drivers.
Apart from the crash on exit - I've got fog, I've got sky, I've got good shadows, I'm not seeing any texture errors, the frame rates are good, the problem of the movies stuttering is gone, the cursor no longer flashes wierd when moved - and while I miss being able to set the AA in the config, I'm able to force it with nHancer anyways.
Though I wish nHancer/nvidia tools properly detected the .exe - I have to set the profile manually... Still, 1600x1200 @ 16xQ coverage sampled AA, 16x AF, Sync on, high texture quality with fraps reporting a solid 85fps.....
KICK ASS.
Hey Timeslip, I do web design/development for a living - you want a free template for your site, ah heck, I'll toss in a custom cms type back-end? Feel I should give you something back for all your greatly appreciated hard work.
bikerdude on 16/3/2008 at 08:51
Quote Posted by Nameless Voice
just yet). The driver version listed by DXDiag is 6.14.0011.6906, so I assume that means 169.06?
yes 169.06. Im running 169.44 on my old 8800ulkrtra with no problems, but as you know your card being G92 based runns much newer driver, the latest being 174.xx.
And is it me or does Thief now look even better with DDfix that it ever did, even better than the original thief2.exe - I get shivers while playing its so good....
Quote Posted by DeathShadow
I Feel I should give you something back for all your greatly appreciated hard work.
hey DS, nice one dude :-) I offered him a Radeon X300 so he could test DDfix on that, but he graciously declined ;-)
biker
Dusk-Sailor on 16/3/2008 at 12:27
Quote Posted by deathshadow
T2 now crashes on quitting the game... No big deal, you WANT to exit the program at that point anyways - but thought I should mention it. The specific error is:
The exception unknown software exception (0xc0000005) occured in the application at location 0x00183abc
I can confess that since version 1.2.4
But no major deal.
Thanks NV for updating the exe Thief Gold. Works well on OM's. :thumb:
But CTD when loading any Thief 1 FM :idea:
(169.28 on 8800GT, Win XP)
Calibrator on 16/3/2008 at 13:57
Quote Posted by Timeslip
Odd. Taking screenshots by printscreen should always be slow now. (Takes ~4 seconds on my computer.) It certainly shouldn't take <1 second if the attempt was successfull. :confused:
Anyway, I'm off for the weekend so it's too late to do major anything about it now. I've made one little tweak to my screenshot code, so you can try redownloading and seeing if printscreen is a little less buggy now. (I didn't change the version number; it's still 1.2.4.)
I can confirm no problems on an ATI X1950XTX, Catalyst v8.3 on XP Pro SP2!
Color fidelity is much better than with the default 16 bit rendering - very noticeably in dark situations (not unlikely in these games ;-).
Menu and readables come up instantaneously and movies play without problems.
Saving a screen takes about two seconds (CPU: Opteron 185 which has the same performance as a Athlon64 X2 5000+).
Thank you very much for improving this program and making Thief somewhat "futureproof"!
:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
Calibrator
Hiatus on 16/3/2008 at 20:19
I've notice a strange (?) thing when looking at some textures up close. DDfixed versions looks like color transitions/banding are more visible. Is it normal when running in 32-bit with some textures which probably weren't designed to look good in 32-bit color but in 16-bit one? I'd appreciate if someone could explain it. To me, 16-bit version looks better "blended" and thus more natural in this case.
here's ddfix (32-bit color):
(
http://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ddfixgp3.png)
here's vanilla T2 (16-bit color):
(
http://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vanth3.png)
(they're both very dark, so please turn up brightness on your monitor).
Does 16-bit shot (vanilla T2) looks more blended because of dithering being used, which is not used/needed(?) in 32-bit color any more? 32-bit shot looks to me like 8-bit(?) shot from vanilla T1/TG when looking at a texture up close (color transitions are clearly visible in both cases, resulting in visible banding). Just to clarify: vanilla T1/TG uses 8-bit color in H/W accelerated mode and thus doesn't use/need dithering at all? Is dithering only needed/used in 16-bit color mode, and 8/32-bit never use it? Thanks for clarification.
smithpd on 16/3/2008 at 21:16
Quote Posted by Bikerdude
And is it me or does Thief now look even better with DDfix that it ever did, even better than the original thief2.exe - I get shivers while playing its so good....
It is not you. DDFIX 1.2.4 definitely looks better than the original. When I walk close to the vine on the wall at the start of Running Interference, I can see that the original Thief 2 has dithering, which previously was rendered OK with ATI, and old Nvidia cards like the 4200, but badly with Nvidia 8800. With DDFIX 1.2.4, I see just smooth color variation with no dithering. I think this is because DDFIX renders with 32 bits rather than 16 bits.
I have made some screen shots which show the dithering (with original T2) or not (with DDFIX 2.1.4). All these were done as BMPs and converted to JPGs at the end. I stored them as JPGs avoid overflowing my file storage space. The JPGs are a faithful rendition of the BMP even if they themselves cannot be zoomed. I have zoomed examples below.
Screen shots without zooming in (BMP converted directly to JPG)(
http://home.comcast.net/~smithpd1/thief/Original_T2_dithering_Ti4200.jpg) Original_T2_dithering_Ti4200.jpg
(
http://home.comcast.net/~smithpd1/thief/Original_T2_dithering_7950GT.jpg) Original_T2_dithering_7950GT.jpg
(
http://home.comcast.net/~smithpd1/thief/DDFIXed_T2_no_dithering_7950GT.jpg) DDFIXed_T2_no_dithering_7950GT.jpg
Zooming in to BMP using MS Paint and converting to JPG afterward(
http://home.comcast.net/~smithpd1/thief/Original_T2_dithering_Ti4200_zoom.jpg) Original_T2_dithering_Ti4200_zoom.jpg
(
http://home.comcast.net/~smithpd1/thief/Original_T2_dithering_7950GT_zoom.jpg) Original_T2_dithering_7950GT_zoom.jpg
(
http://home.comcast.net/~smithpd1/thief/DDFIXed_T2_no_dithering_7950GT_zoom.jpg) DDFIXed_T2_no_dithering_7950GT_zoom.jpg
Note that the 7950GT original, with dithering, has a purplish color, that is not as faithful as the 7950 GT with DDFIX. 7950GT original also has bad sky and no stars. Ti4200 has better colors and good sky, but still no stars. I have taken my ATI X1950 Pro card out, but take my word for it, the ATI card with the original Thief has good colors and good sky, like the Ti4200, but stars as well. The ATI card with the original Thief has similar dithering to the 7950 GT. With DDFIX 1.2.4, I cannot tell any difference between the ATI X1950 Pro and the 7950GT. They both have good sky, stars, fog, and no dithering.
EDIT: changed zooming method to use Paint instead of Hypersnap.
EDIT2: changed reference to old DDFIX. I think both are 32 bit.
EDIT3: changed summary at the end.
