Judith on 3/7/2013 at 07:09
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Engage with the fans, talk to them, discuss the canon, discuss the FMs. Even run dev sponsored FM competitions with prizes - you may discover talent that you want to recruit (its happened before), but at the very least the entire engagement would mean that Thief is in the gamer psyche - its there discussed on games sites like JoyStiq, Destructoid, Kotaku.
While such approach would be commendable, but I'm afraid it's different from the reality devs live in. Narrative in Thief was usually sketchy with a lot of bits and pieces either to be picked up during the gameplay or things left for imagination. So there's no canon per se and everything is possible. And these are not my words, some of the ex-lgs/ionstorm employees said that several times during their interviews or keynotes (e.g. Harvey Smith (or was it Randy?), Jordan Thomas). Some of the fans memorized those bits as (too) meaningful and important, filled the holes with their imagination and built "a living world" inside their heads. While this is a nice homage, it's not exactly healthy to live in such place 24/7 (see jtr7).
Secondly, I wouldn't want to engage the fans at this point, since they're almost too <strike>aggressive</strike> passionate about the series, the don't have that bit of distance to themselves and their work — and that is always needed to do something creative and meaningful. Passionate fans are not really an equal partner in such discussion. As for the recruitment, there isn't that much need for modelers and level designers in the industry right now. Those FM makers who really wanted to find the job, already got it (Digi, Purah etc.) and they didn't need special competitions. Good engine or AI programmers, on the other hand... There's always shortage of those ;) I am not to say that we shouldn't have competitions at all, something like Make Something Unreal Contest would be nice, from time to time. Or at least something like Bethesda does on their blog, mentioning the most interesting things done by fans.
Springheel on 6/7/2013 at 11:00
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http://gamestar.ru/english/thief_interview_eng.html)
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Thief modding community has been remarkably active throughout the years and has come up with hundreds upon hundreds of fan-made missions. Do you have any plans of releasing the modding tools to the PC community after the game is shipped? Have you played any fan missions or the standalone Doom 3 based Dark Mod (heavily influenced by Thief), perhaps?
SR: This is a great question, we don’t have any plans to release modding tools after the game has shipped but it’s an interesting idea.
Vae on 6/7/2013 at 11:32
What a surprise..."we don't have any plans to release modding tools after the game has shipped".
This is a fundamental misstep from EM...Their callous disregard for mutual benefit, reveals how out of touch they are with the community, and NuThief's viability in relation to it.
Chade on 6/7/2013 at 12:06
FWIW, I don't think there's all that much point in releasing an editor unless the game hits it off with the community. Particularly in a world where we have The Dark Mod, I don't see fans having much reason to play FMs for thief 4 unless they genuinely want to keep experiencing the underlying game mechanics.
Also, they didn't actually say they wouldn't do it. They just said they haven't planned to do so.
SubJeff on 6/7/2013 at 14:52
With this kind of development would you have to plan early for a toolkit release due to licensing issues?
Shinrazero on 6/7/2013 at 16:53
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
The bonkers thing about it, if you really think about it, is that there are so many Thief fans still around partly (only partly, but still) due to the existence of the FM community.
If I were to be in charge I'd have a long term strategy. Make the best Thief game we can with tools that we can give to the fans, a la Dromed. If the game is good it will do well. If the toolset it good FMs will be made regardless of whether the game was fantastic
as long as the mechanics are right.
Engage with the fans, talk to them, discuss the canon, discuss the FMs. Even run dev sponsored FM competitions with prizes - you may discover talent that you want to recruit (its happened before), but at the very least the entire engagement would mean that Thief is in the gamer psyche - its there discussed on games sites like JoyStiq, Destructoid, Kotaku.
The engagement would also allow for cross fertilisation of ideas - fans suggesting stuff to the devs, the devs explaining how stuff can be implemented in the toolkit. And ultimately when it comes to DLC the devs could implement suggested stuff or even just nods to fans and particular FMS.
And that goes double for sequels - the incorporation of stuff that the fans thought would be really cool but which isn't possible, yet, with the current tools.
Of course all of this idea sharing would have to come with a caveat that any info given is free and there are no IP issues.
Given the highly prolific FM output here even so many years after Thief 1 and 2 were released, the evidence of high fan engagement as seen in TDM, I think the developers are missing a trick and a half here. Done right they could end up with a crazy hardcore of fans and massive constant publicity machine.
The short sightedness is... sad.
I completely agree. This sort of approach would perpetuate the greatness of this community.
Chade on 7/7/2013 at 02:20
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
With this kind of development would you have to plan early for a toolkit release due to licensing issues?
Beats me. Maybe. Maybe licensing costs less then the labour saved by using the tool. I don't think we have any way of knowing.
webe123 on 7/7/2013 at 05:31
Quote Posted by Renzatic
Not necessarily. If an editor were to come out for it (which is really doubtful, but you never know), it'd be built around the UDK, which, assuming everything but the renderer are relatively unmolested, you'd be able to edit down to deeper levels more easily than you would Dromed. Worst case scenario is that it'd end up about like T3Ed, but without any of the hardware restrictions.
THAT is pure speculation.
There is not even a hint of a rumor that an editor will be available, but I seriously doubt it will be as you describe....better and easier to use than dromed...now I think are dreaming.
I still think there will be NO editor this time around. And I also think that is a good thing.
Renzatic on 7/7/2013 at 05:37
You're right. The editor will probably be made for console tards.
Also, Dromed is not easy to use. At all.
webe123 on 7/7/2013 at 05:41
Quote Posted by Renzatic
You're right. The editor will probably be made for console tards.
Also, Dromed is not easy to use. At all.
If you are having trouble using dromed, then the fault is yours, not the editors.
I have learned how to use it and I am not very technical at all when it comes to that sort of thing.
But like I said, I don't think we have to worry about an editor for this game being made, so the point is moot.