Rope Arrow on 19/8/2013 at 19:33
*Sigh* I'm trying... I'm really trying. I am trying to reserve judgement until the thing actually is near finished and comes out. I have even been warming up somewhat to this idea of a Focus mechanic. I mean, I don't know about most, but my first playthroughs of Thief games have always been heavily reliant on quicksave, which is essentially an 'erase any mistake' button. That's how how made up for not
myself being a master thief, by using what is essentially the power of precognition. So perhaps an optional Detective Mode-type feature wouldn't be such a horrible addition. Especially if you can completely disable, or even selectively disable certain elements of it.
But seriously... That bridge-running sequence. When I saw (
http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2013/185/0/1/thief___escape_audale_bridge_by_matlatart-d6bzbem.jpg) this image on dA, I started to get this bad feeling. But now it seems it's confirmed; the new Thief contains at least one sequence of disguised QTEs where you must run down a linear corridor in exactly the way the devs intended or be immediately stomped on by an environment that is burning and exploding around you, speeding by so fast that the carnage blurs into meaninglessness. Because anything that isn't Call of Duty isn't Call of Duty enough. =/
I also think back to the good ol' days of 1998, where they made games in which climbing ropes could be affixed to any surface, and were only restricted for purposes of player challenge. And where you could climb up onto almost any ledge that five-foot eight man could reach with outstretched arms. It's a little depressing to think how big a deal that would be in today's games.
*Sigh* Reserving judgement. Early days yet. Wait and see...
SubJeff on 19/8/2013 at 20:57
I don't want to be judgemental but relying on quick save to erase mistakes is rather unsporting.
It would also remove the tension in the game.
Rope Arrow on 19/8/2013 at 21:30
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
I don't want to be judgemental but relying on quick save to erase mistakes is rather unsporting.
It would also remove the tension in the game.
Heh, no arguments from me, friend. In fact, swing by my thread in the General Discussion if you have some advice on how to break that bad habit of mine.
My point is though that not everyone would be against the something that takes the edge of the merciless level of challenge present in the best of stealth games, even among the people that love Thief as I do. I like a game that can make a few concessions to my bumbling attempts to learn the ropes, and then can be played with the training wheels off. Player-enforced challenge is one of the things that makes Thief so replayable.
Though I can definitely concede the point that the original LGS games
had all of this without being stuffed full of HUD features. No matter what difficulty you played on or what personal challenges you put on yourself, you could always rely on your eyes, ears, and patience to tell you everything you needed to know.
Brian The Dog on 19/8/2013 at 21:56
Quote Posted by fett
Yeah, rope arrow points are extremely troublesome to me because it largely means the world isn't "open" in the sense that the original two were. There was that illusion in Dishonored and I didn't notice the restrictions as much because there were a lot of extremely fun and diverse paths and options to play with - I never felt constrained. But I expect more from a Thief game where I should be able to manipulate the environment in a way no one else has yet by box stacking, etc. If I can't make my own way, but am instead led down (an illusion of) several paths that converge no matter my approach, that's going to suck.
I said waaaaay back when T4 was announced that the most important thing was freedom to explore the world, even if that meant breaking it. But no AAA game is going to go to the shelf that unpolished - especially purposefully.
This is more of a general question, but fett was the last person to mention this so I'm quoting him - I've not followed the T4 development much, but what have they said they will do with the rope arrows? If you can only put them in certain places, why is that different to Thief 1/2 where Rope and Vine arrows were limited to certain surfaces, and hence the level design meant that freedom could still be constrained (or rewarded!)?
I've lost faith in T4 being a sensible stealth game considering the stories about lack of free-play, scripting and lack of jumping. I could live with a generic stealth game in a medieval setting (although I understand why others would not) but these issues would impair almost any FPS game, never-mind a Stealth FPS game. I may still buy the game, but on sale a year or so later, not a first-day release, which is what I originally planned.
Chade on 19/8/2013 at 22:05
The rope arrow constraints in thief 4 are a great deal more constraining then limiting rope arrows to a specific class of textures.
While I'm here: thief 4 will certainly involve a great deal of free play, the vast majority of moments throughout the game will not be interacting with scripted events, and jumping still exists, but it is true that there's going to be a black box inside the game determining whether your "jump" is going to be a swoop, jump, or some sort of climb.
Brian The Dog on 19/8/2013 at 22:21
OK, thanks, that's allayed my fears somewhat. After hearing some things that have been reported, I was beginning to wonder if the Devs had no game design knowledge at all. I'm still not buying a first-day copy, but I might not wait for it to be in the £5 bin.
Goldmoon Dawn on 19/8/2013 at 22:25
There will be wooden surfaces high up that you will *not* be able to Rope Arrow up to. If it doesnt contextually lead to anything productive, the Rope Arrow will not go. There will be "hotspots" that you can shoot a Rope Arrow into, not any and all wooden surfaces.
Chade on 19/8/2013 at 22:26
Quote Posted by Brian The Dog
OK, thanks, that's allayed my fears somewhat.
To be clear, there are some (supposedly rare) sections of the game where there will be no free play and a lot of scripted events.
