The RIGHT thing to do... - by pad_illa
chris the cynic on 17/11/2003 at 10:36
The Tong ending (or "boom" as it is sometimes called) is a bit more complex than most realize. You see travel from one side of a city to the other is very limited at the time of Deus Ex, travel between them I almost unheard of.
If you remember truckers were basically the only ones who did it by ground, and by the time that the game starts even they decided it was too dangerous and were on strike.
It gets better, at the end of the game there is a global riot, now that strikes me as fun. It also makes me think that people will be more concerned with staying alive at first then fixing the system or instituting solid mail.
Of course the riots will end, but when they do things will have changed, for one thing even without the communications down the militaries had become fragmented, and the countries were breaking down. With no communications the system may well have collapsed. This was part of a shapr decline witnessed over a time period of at most 24 hours, I don't think that the global communications black out will help to slow the degradation of order.
And while we're on the subject of blackouts, there is now a global Internet controlled power grid (strikes me as a bad idea) that obviously goes down. Now when it does we have that fun rioting, putting the power back up won't be the first priority. And waiting for it to die down might not help, in major rioting including blackouts the power stations are usually ransacked. (Talk about weird mob logic “I'm pissed my power went out so I'm going to smash the place and make it so that it won't go back on for quite a while.”)
And when that power does come back on we have the credits. The global electronic currency. See it lives online, it's no like those chits have much value on their own, it's like having a credit card when the companies system is out, it just doesn't work.
So after an indeterminate amount of time the power goes back on and there is still no communications, there is no money. Fair bet is that some system be it barter or new currency will be instituted, but that will differ from place to place. Of course getting from place to place is an issue. After all if it wasn't safe to move between cities with a unified and coordinated policing force it certainly shouldn't be safe without one.
But the thing that really gets me is motive. Already parts of militaries have gone out on their own to take over some turf for themselves. Afterwards there is a need to be self-sustaining at lest until it is feasible to join other people. For that they need a government, now we already know that on the streets in many places the gangs over rule the cops, they get that power by being the most vicious.
That is probably how many of the new city or smaller sized governments will be formed. If that is the case then you have to wonder if the people who have the ability would even want to restore what was there before. Before they didn't have too much power, but know they are rulers, life is better for them now that society collapsed.
It goes on, and on, and on. And I'm sure that I've bored everyone quite thoroughly already.
Fred Chook on 17/11/2003 at 10:56
So there'll be anarchy. There'll be fewer technologies to enjoy. So? We knew all this. For some of us this is WHY we chose this ending. Besides, I really doubt that EVERYWHERE will become Mad Max. The chaotic, dangerous US of DX is the most extreme place in the world, remember - some places still have their acts together. They could survive. And if the NSF can have a massive EMP-field-fuelling generator, I'm sure a few other people have big ones around too. It won't be so bad.
chris the cynic on 18/11/2003 at 01:02
I'm not sure you do comprehend, there is a global riot. Global.
Society is a system, it goes kuput. The network crashes, communications, travel, economy, trade.
Not necessarily anarchy, but not going to be close to repaired anytime in the next several decades.
Maybe you do get it, maybe you don't. But the point is that it is more than just the communications or the economy, the entire system that is society crashes.
Fred Chook on 18/11/2003 at 03:28
This is worse than the world being taken over by all-powerful malevolent powers how?
chris the cynic on 18/11/2003 at 05:55
I wasn't saying it was worse. I just wasn't sure that you understood was all.
Retischal on 18/11/2003 at 17:38
Quote:
Originally posted by chris the cynic Maybe you do get it, maybe you don't. But the point is that it is more than just the communications or the economy, the entire system that is society crashes.
Yeah, it seemed to me that in the Tong ending, the world was plunged into the dark ages without technology, so there wouldn't be proper medical care etc. People would suffer much worse than before. I choOse the (I think) Illuminati ending, where things went on much the same as before.
Sadly, the merging with AI ending didn't change depending on how you had played the game.. Ie. If you were a maniacal cowboy or a "non-lethal" infiltrating character.
Fred Chook on 18/11/2003 at 19:50
I don't believe that. It seems obvious to me that a lot of systems aren't going to be internet-controlled. All of X51, for a start. The medbots certainly don't seem to be netcontrolled, and they're battery-powered - and heaven knows there's enough batteries around. Like I said, if the NSF can have that powerful a generator illegally inside a warehouse I bet there's plenty more. People are already relying on themselves and each other far more than the government, thanks to the collapses already happening. They're set to survive.
chris the cynic on 19/11/2003 at 06:12
Of course they're going to survive killing off everyone wasn't an option (though if it were that would no doubt be a popular one) what won't survive is the system.
Shipping is already dead, or to be more accurate spasming on the floor while blood loss and brain trauma fight to be the one to kill it. We all know why.
So with an already starving populous, the fact that powerplants are often destroyed in black outs that coincide with riots, no shipping, and no communications things will change. For one power will be very limited, not gone, simply limited. Those batteries (in the bots) are organic by the way, organic things die. With no production company making more what will happen? Even if they wouldn't die you'd still run out at some point, unless you think that people are just going to start up the production again without pay.
What good does a power generator do you without food? Maybe you trade the power for food, but who has the food to trade? Where do they get the food? How does it get transported? All of this has to be set up, because the old system crashed.
With no shipping cities are not the best places, as it takes soil to produce food.
There are more ramifications that I'm sure we all know about. So yes, people are set to survive, but society as it exists at the time is not.
Fred Chook on 19/11/2003 at 07:50
Yeeeep, but that's the point. Get rid of the huge, opressive capitalist society and start one of small communes. :)
Lytha on 22/11/2003 at 13:29
Lets leave this whole <i>"wah, there will be chaos and darkness and RIOTS all over the place"</i>-debate aside for a moment.
There are other problems with the Dark Age ending, I am afraid.
In short:
(1) Everett has his own Echelon System in the backroom.
(2) Tong's Computer has a pyramid with an eye in it as logo.
There are most certainly more hooks and pins in the story that I haven't yet considered, too. ;)
ad (1) - So, we take out the current Echelon System by blowing up Area 51. However, there is someone in some other place who has the prototype for that Echelon System still alive and well. What prevents him from developing his prototype into a replacement for Daedalus/Icarus that we just blew up? What prevents him from sneaking slowly into the position as the "invisible hand" that rules the world with this tool in his hands?
Most certainly not JC. Because JC has clearly expressed that he does not want to be on Everett's side anymore, when he refused to hand over Area 51 instead of destroying it. By clearly taking another side than Everett, we just lost any chance to handle this problem at gunpoint. :p
ad (2) - A pyramid with an eye in it is the symbol of the illuminati. What would such a logo do on Tong's computer? Who is this Tong, anyway? How comes that he knew a lot of the former leaders of the illuminati (interestingly, only those who you are going to meet later, or who are dead... Weren't there any more than Dowd, du Clare and Everett? - I don't think so.)
I think he knew all those leaders of the illuminati because he was or IS one of them.
Are you sure you can really trust him?
That said... I still prefer the Dark Age ending. Although, the Illuminati-Ending gained a few more points. As the right hand of Everett, you would have a chance to find out more about how his dictatorship of the "invisible hand" is working - and to shut this dictatorship down then totally. But it would probably be a long task, and not made easier by sparing Area 51 and handing it over to the dictator.
