Stitch on 6/4/2010 at 21:00
I will say this much: much of Jokerman's initial anger hinges, I think, upon him misreading my original post (or, just as likely, me not communicating my point clearly enough). I was wondering where his subsequent comments about me speaking for "us" to "the new guy" were coming from, but it actually makes some sense if you read my original post as claiming that his argument wasn't going to do him any favors "here" in this place, in this community. What I meant, and perhaps could have clarified better, is that his argument wasn't going to do him any good "here" in this debate, in this exchange.
Jokerman on 6/4/2010 at 21:16
You need to leave the trolling business to the pros- like dethtoll or what's his name... kiki
ETA:
Quote:
his argument wasn't going to do him any good "here"
Actually, I made no arguments, only asked Ench' if he avoids content over style, or rather- delivery, considerations.
And what argument could I make?- I think the guy is an excellent actor who found an original shtick which grows on you (well- me) with each viewing. And that's a matter of taste- which I can't argue.
Stitch on 6/4/2010 at 22:10
Quote Posted by Jokerman
You need to leave the trolling business to the pros- like dethtoll or what's his name... kiki
Okay, we're done here. You aren't even trying at this point.
Enchantermon on 6/4/2010 at 22:51
Quote Posted by Jokerman
Actually, I made no arguments, only asked Ench' if he avoids content over style, or rather- delivery, considerations.
Only if the style/delivery is horrible enough that I cannot focus on the content.
fett on 6/4/2010 at 23:29
OKAY EVERYBODY JUST SHUT THE FUCK UP. I'm looking for some good ol' group bitterness toward Rick McCccallllum here. Please just let me have this one thing.
Scots Taffer on 7/4/2010 at 00:28
Looks like TTLG is dying again... slowly, from a bullet to the gut, faeces and blood mixing on the floor. Wailing. Gnashing of teeth. Etcetera.
Anyway, I just want to quote this:
Quote Posted by Stitch
Defending this guy's decision to hurf away in novocain-lipped monotone isn't going to do you any favors here. Regardless of justification, the result is utterly cringe-worthy, as are the failed attempts at dark humor.
I totally agree and it's the primary reason I couldn't make it through sixty fucking minutes or however long the Phantom Menace one is. As soon as I hit the gagged woman in the basement I figured the incidence of shit was soon going to outweigh the gold and I quit, which is a shame because I liked, and agreed, with a lot of what he had to say on the prequels and why they failed. Of course, my personal hobby rather than just actively deconstruct things is to also put time towards thinking how they could've done it better. It's a little
too easy to rag on Jar Jar at this point in our cultural history, given how utterly despised the prequels are.
FYI Jokerman, I read the "do you any favors (sic) here" line as referring to this current place of discussion on this topic (not on your posting this thread in CommChat) as the review was perfectly capable of being as funny and incisive without the use of a dumb accent and weird cutaways to gagged women. I think this is ultimately what Stitch was trying to say.
Starrfall on 7/4/2010 at 02:33
There's bug sex in the extended universe you know.
fett on 7/4/2010 at 03:23
Quote Posted by Starrfall
There's bug sex in the extended universe you know.
I think you might be saying you've read the Dark Nest series in which case I'm very turned on right now.
Jokerman on 7/4/2010 at 05:51
Quote Posted by Scots Taffer
FYI Jokerman, I read the "do you any favors (sic) here" line as referring to this current place of discussion on this topic (not on your posting this thread in CommChat) as the review was perfectly capable of being as funny and incisive without the use of a dumb accent and weird cutaways to gagged women. I think this is ultimately what Stitch was trying to say.
Ye ye ye, he already cleared that point.
It also should have been clear to him right from my initial reaction that his words were misinterpreted.
Instead of mending it there and then, he chose to be a dumb ass about it and later be proud about being a dumb ass.
By the time he cleared things up, there was little to none sympathy left in me. I'm only human, let's move on.
Back OT-
I can't argue with you if you found his speech cringe-worthy and his humor weird and unfunny, but if you think he could be AS good WITHOUT all the crude cuts and Novocaine gargle, I'm afraid you missed the point entirely. Like saying that Jim Jarmusch sucks cos his films are slow and sleep-inducing.
Hmmm.. Let's see:
-By creating an impossible, paradoxical character- a psychopath with a highly developed EQ, a nerd that understands women,- he echoes the paradoxical, impossible nature of George Lucas himself. The man who, in the span of mere 20 years, changed from being one of the most prominent myth-weavers amongst film-makers to the "master in the art of ruining things".
You probably haven't noticed that. But your brain did.
-The inhumanity of his character reflects the lack of humanity and genuine emotions in the prequels. They're both like empty shells. His thoughts' tendency to wander away reflects the cinematic experience of watching the prequels.
-The crude, "wrong" cuts symbolizes the hastened, misbegotten production of the prequels.
- His misogyny reflects that of the films.
You see? It works on so many levels...
Angel Dust on 7/4/2010 at 07:27
For me the fact that his criticisms are so accurate and actually focus on the fundamental storytelling and film making errors as well as usual 'raping of the Star Wars mythos', that I didn't mind that the humour was hit and miss. The 'shit to gold ratio' never shifted towards the former either.
Quote Posted by Scots Taffer
Of course, my personal hobby rather than just actively deconstruct things is to also put time towards thinking how they could've done it better. It's a little
too easy to rag on Jar Jar at this point in our cultural history, given how utterly despised the prequels are.
I would posit that these films are so fundamentally broken, with absolutely no redeeming features, that the only thing to be suggested is a complete do over and in that case you're not really talking about how to make
The Phantom Menace better but about another film entirely. For what it's worth he, the reviewer, does make some suggestions e.g. part V outlines a couple of character arcs for Obi-Wan.
