MrBosnia on 8/5/2008 at 00:52
Quote Posted by BR796164
You're either a puristic paleomarxist or a technocrat.
Humans started to question the existence or non-existence of god (or "supernatural being" if you will) rationally, logically and clearly about as long as they are humans. Ironically they haven't been able to find a definitive for or against proof to this day. Welcome to the world.
To clarify to all what I meant,
I meant that the roots of a religion were founded in attempt to discipline the human mind and keep it moral. Religion was founded on war, but in attempt to civilize human beings.
Try Atheist. And what does a technocracy have to do with arguing Atheist rationality?
The_Raven on 8/5/2008 at 02:26
My point was when people see red, the color is merely what they perceive; It may, or may not, be truly representative to its "true" form. It is also very possible that other animals, or people, may perceive it to be a different color. This is why I wrote that the color red, as we perceive it, doesn't really exist.
(*) I remember hearing that pigeons have four primary color receptors in their retinas, as opposed to the 3 primary color receptors that humans have.
Tonamel on 8/5/2008 at 02:43
Quote Posted by Louis Cypher
Seriously: did the guy have any business doing magic tricks for kids as opposed to teaching?
Have you ever been a substitute teacher? If you get saddled with a bad class, then after a while you'll be willing to try just about anything to make them stop throwing pencils at you. In several of the districts I worked at, subs weren't allowed to discipline the students, because they're not "real" teachers. That doesn't exactly encourage good behavior in the kids.
But yeah, if the teachers had been leaving him lesson plans (which is somewhat rare), and he wasn't following them, then the school had every right to give him the boot. But if that's the case, why wait until a Wizardry complaint to do it (which could of course be coincidence)?
Turtle on 8/5/2008 at 04:39
Quote Posted by Tonamel
why wait until a Wizardry complaint to do it
I just wanted to point out that this is my favorite phrase of the day.
MrBosnia on 8/5/2008 at 05:42
Quote Posted by The_Raven
My point was when people see red, the color is merely what they perceive; It may, or may not, be truly representative to its "true" form. It is also very possible that other animals, or people, may perceive it to be a different color. This is why I wrote that the color red,
as we perceive it, doesn't really exist.
(*) I remember hearing that pigeons have four primary color receptors in their retinas, as opposed to the 3 primary color receptors that humans have.
Good job The_Raven, you've basically posed the ancient philosophical question in metaphysics concerning whether anything in the universe exists at all. Too bad it doesn't help us much. If you think about it, you could argue that nothing really exists at all.
On a serious counter to your point,
Red is indeed red. Every single human being sees the same red, as biological study supports it. If every single human being perceives red as an intense fiery hue in their retina, then it is an objective red. There is no human being nor will there ever be one who sees the "true" red.
aguywhoplaysthief on 8/5/2008 at 06:11
Quote Posted by Tocky
That's exactly what I was saying to my dead demon chicken the other day.
I would pay a thousand dollars to see you talking to an actual dead demon chicken.
Ben Gunn on 8/5/2008 at 06:42
Quote Posted by MrBosnia
Good job The_Raven, you've basically posed the ancient philosophical question in metaphysics concerning whether anything in the universe exists at all. Too bad it doesn't help us much. If you think about it, you could argue that nothing really exists at all.
Not necessarily. Have you heard about the term intersubjectivity? Kant came up with that one. According to him- things do exist whether there are humans or not but we cant really know what's their true nature cos all we see and know is filtered through our brains. Even time and space are not things in themselves but forms with which our minds grasp the world.
Red is not an objective trait but there is no reason to think that different ppl see different reds cos on the basic levels our brain/minds are the same.
So 'red' is an intersubjective trait.
Quote Posted by MrBosnia
Every single human being sees the same red, as biological study supports it.
Can you point me to that study?
ercles on 8/5/2008 at 07:04
Quote Posted by MrBosnia
Red is indeed red. Every single human being sees the same red, as biological study supports it. If every single human being perceives red as an intense fiery hue in their retina, then it is an objective red. There is no human being nor will there ever be one who sees the "true" red.
I would love to see a study that manages to prove that all human beings percieve reality in the same way. I assume you mean that all humans with healthy vision see red the same way, considering color blindeness, and such.
SubJeff on 8/5/2008 at 07:22
Quote Posted by The_Raven
My point was when people see red, the color is merely what they perceive; It may, or may not, be truly representative to its "true" form. It is also very possible that other animals, or people, may perceive it to be a different color. This is why I wrote that the color red,
as we perceive it, doesn't really exist.
(*) I remember hearing that pigeons have four primary color receptors in their retinas, as opposed to the 3 primary color receptors that humans have.
This is true of everything. Perhaps what we feel as hot pigeons feel as cold.
Everything is "merely" what we perceive.
And Kant's idea is just an idea. It's a perfectly rational idea, but there is no way of proving it. Even if you could "possess" other people there would be no way of knowing whether your perception of the world through their eyes was skewed by your experience.
I think it likely that red is indeed perceived in pretty much the same way by everyone given that the eye and brain are roughly the same in everyone. But then is any of that "real" anyway?
Tonamel on 8/5/2008 at 07:25
Quote Posted by Turtle
I just wanted to point out that this is my favorite phrase of the day.
You're welcome.
