Kolya on 18/4/2009 at 16:17
Yeah, and mazzortock has said several times that this is fine with him, everyone's entitled to their own opinion, etc.
Whether one agrees with his arguments or not, he's been acting way more civilised the whole time than most people in this thread. Even if he was completely and utterly wrong, which I don't believe to be true, he still has that going for him.
That being said, if someone gave me an Iphone for free, I'd take it and use it with a nerdy grin on my face for the next week. I wouldn't buy one though. Too costly and for me not worth it.
Vivian on 18/4/2009 at 16:18
fucks sake Koyla, it's the tired old Internet anarchist bullshit that annoys me, not the broken English. Unless being Italian excuses you from shitty sloganeering as well.
Kolya on 18/4/2009 at 16:23
Well if anyone holds the flag of internet anarchism it's Italian linux freaks, probably.
Renzatic on 18/4/2009 at 16:38
Quote Posted by David
Ok, well, I guess fair enough, then.
I've tinkered with the Windows 7 beta, which is a vast step up from Vista, but I feel they need to almost step back and take a look at the whole thing. It still seems very 'bitty' as though the designers and programmers of individual sections didn't communicate or have a plan on how things should look and operate. Consequently it doesn't feel very 'gelled'. It's not a bad OS at all, but not as good as OSX, or XP (from a UI and usability point of view) in my opinion.
I find 7 to be quite a bit more streamlined than XP...if you use the Superbar properly. Dock it to the left side of the screen, turn off autohide, set the pop up windows to no mouseover delay, and have a ball with the jumplists and libraries. With that, I can navigate through open windows and find things I'm looking for far faster than I ever could with XP. Throw Switcher in the mix, and I'm zooming around like gangbusters ballswild.
Though as good as 7 is, I do agree that it still falls short of the clean and homogeneous feel OSX sports.
Quote:
You made some good valid points here, i partially agree. Yes, on the opensource world it's also important to make things usable for all the people and not by a geek restricted clan. Is important too to get some visibility on projects that already works (you right recall Gimp, OpenOffice, etc etc), but IMHO they do not have to make the same mistake of the proprietary world: a good software have to be chose by people for his features, quality, usefulness, and not for billion dollars marketing campaigns and hypes that more or less impose a status symbol on people. They must develop some kind of consciousness raising to this kind of themes, and this can be done, IMHO, only with a better science scholarisation of people. Of course, as always, my 0,02.
That's just it. You don't have to have a billion dollar marketing campaign to get your product out there. Hell, a good name, some banner advertisements, and a bit more outside communication is all you need. That worked wonders with Firefox and OpenOffice. But, like what was stated somewhere above, the Open Source scenesters love keeping stuff inside their insular little clique, and you rarely ever see that happen.
mazzortock on 18/4/2009 at 16:45
Quote Posted by Vivian
fucks sake Koyla, it's the tired old Internet anarchist bullshit that annoys me, not the broken English.
So the problem are my "Old Internet anarchist bullshit" slogans, nice.
Anyway it's interesting that for all arguments mentioned by me here, you are focusing only on my broken expressions (as Koyla right argued, i speak very badly in english, i really apologize for that) about the brand name and the company of your mobile-phone.
Vivian on 18/4/2009 at 17:03
Yes, I'm focusing on the stupid old crap you're spouting about people worshiping apple like a god, because people who think its even worth saying shit like that really piss me off. Like when you see some fucking goon swanning about in a 'fuck bush' t shirt thinking he's blowing the worlds lid off. Yes, I am perfectly aware there are a large number of apple customers for whom 'ooh a shiny thing' plays a large point in their buying strategy, but I made a fairly considered opinion to get an iphone based on its ease of use and what it could do, and to have some twat (excuse the expression, I'm sure) like you telling me I only did it because I think apple are cool and because I worship them is REALLY FUCKING ANNOYING. You can claim its because I hate Italians or whatever, but thats the real reason.
Rug Burn Junky on 18/4/2009 at 17:54
mazzertock has a point, even if he's a really bad proponent of his argument. Closed systems tend to be detrimental on a number of levels, both for individual consumers, and society as a whole, though the costs aren't always self evident, nor are the efficiencies gained by open networks readily apparent. But they are very very real, and they need to be incentivized.
I'm not going to wade too far into the massive argument on this, but I suggest any of you who are actually interested take a look at Yochai Benkler's book, (
http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/wealth_of_networks/Main_Page)
The Wealth of Networks: How Social Production Transforms Markets and Freedom. Putting his money where his mouth is - the entire book is available to read online in a number of formats, under a creative commons license. I just finished reading it myself, and it's a brilliant analysis.
Apple themselves are prime perpetrators of closed systems, and that does tend to turn me off. Their business model depends on keeping people downloading media files for $ from itunes, rather than getting them for free elsewhere on the net. I don't want to be locked in as one of their consumers. Whereas the wired internet is generally content neutral (for now), there are significant tolls for different types of content with most wireless carriers, and Apple is a prime mover in this area.
I don't avoid the iPhone for this reason* - since open phones have not yet reached stability and maturity. I can't lay it all at their feet because all carriers are pretty bad in this regard (Verizon is frustratingly hamhanded at locking off phone features to prevent you from using them to their full advantage). As consumers, that's bad for all of us.
*I avoid it for the simple reason that I hate the idea of a touch screen as the primary input on a phone.
RavynousHunter on 18/4/2009 at 18:00
Quote Posted by EvaUnit02
Why would I get Macbook when I can get a similarly spec'ed Dell or Toshiba laptop for far less money?
Quote for truth.
EvaUnit02 on 18/4/2009 at 18:45
Quote Posted by David
As for the highly restrictive OS? Other than not allowing it be installed on machines that aren't Macs (aside from a brief Clone period in the mid-90s) this is how it has been since the day Apple started. I'd argue that Windows activation policy (also installation-related) is equally, and arguably more, restrictive.
No, no I meant customising the damn thing. I can tweak Windows to my heart's content - messing around in the registry and the like; chop and change drivers (that make a noticeable different, like for the GPU and sound solution. Open source Unix printer drivers? Yawn.) Not so with OSX. With Windows I don't need to know obscure Unix terminal commands either to radically change it.
Don't get me start on Airport wifi access points and the monitors. Seriously, no setup stored in the firmware that can accessed from any web browser? No OSD or buttons on the Apple monitors? Christ, CinemaDisplays are overpriced junk. I can buy a good quality Dell screen (no TN panel shit) for less money with features and jacks coming out of the arse, including Component input of all things.
Albert on 18/4/2009 at 18:51
I swear, if one more person I know comes up to me and brags about their Iphone, I'll knock em flat! :ebil:
