scumble on 6/10/2018 at 11:13
Politicians are still human, ranging from outrageously corrupt to actually trying to improve the system. But I wonder if too much focus is on who controls the system, rather than whether the system is broken. I find myself thinking debate is pointless if it's stuck on whatever the "big issues" tend to be. The most contentious issues that attract the extreme idiots.
Do humans essentially have to evolve further to be able to make any better systems, or will civilisation collapse before we get there? I've ended up as a sort of pessimistic anti-capitalist anarchist - I'd prefer more decentralisation as damage limitation, but I don't think the groups with power will allow that to happen.
rachel on 6/10/2018 at 14:28
Quote Posted by Starker
I'm a bit surprised something like this can even happen in the US where free speech is apparently one the most sacrosanct things you can think of -- apparently a state official in Texas got offended over a political sign in someone's yard and the police went and confiscated it:
And then they turn and call
their opponents “snowflakes”. Bunch of fucking thin-skinned hypocrites, can't fathom one can have the audacity to rub their nose in their own shit.
Starker on 6/10/2018 at 15:07
Oh, I'm sure free speech advocates will be all over this and it will be discussed non-stop on Fox News. Any moment now.
Trance on 6/10/2018 at 15:14
You know, the majority of the comments attached to that news article are people basically saying "I agree that the sign was pretty terrible, but it was wrong to have it removed". I would wager that that's a fairly accurate cross-section of opinion even among conservatives.
Sulphur on 27/6/2019 at 19:33
I don't see anyone preventing him from speaking his mind. If anything, all of this is happening to him because he's exercising his right to speak without thinking: he's being a tool, and he's reaping the consequences of it. If his contract stipulated a fair social media presence and he broke it, that's on him. GoFundMe is a private platform just like TTLG, and making a decision to not host someone because the campaign (
https://www.gofundme.com/terms) violates their ToS is entirely under their remit.
Starker on 27/6/2019 at 19:38
Obligatory XKCD comic:
(
https://xkcd.com/1357/)
Inline Image:
https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/free_speech.pngAlt text: "I can't remember where I heard this, but someone once said that defending a position by citing free speech is sort of the ultimate concession; you're saying that the most compelling thing you can say for your position is that it's not literally illegal to express."
Nameless Voice on 27/6/2019 at 20:07
Once again, XKCD sums thing up perfectly.
I go back to my earlier argument - I don't think one man's freedom of speech is more important than another man's freedom not to be attacked.
Bigotry is never okay, no matter if it's hidden behind a veneer of "religious grounds".
Threatening a group of people with fictional threats of damnation instead of real-world consequences is still threatening that group people, in this case specifically because of bigotry against their sexual preferences.
Do people have the rights to express such views? Sadly, yes. But every right-thinking person has the right to shun them, and I would argue that they have a moral duty to use that right.
The truly sad thing about the article is the crazies who raised $2m to defend bigotry. Things like that drain what little hope I have left for this world.
Renzatic on 27/6/2019 at 20:32
It all comes down to which you think is more important: the right to speak without being censored by anyone or anything, be they public or private, or the rights of a property owner to control his assets as he pleases. To maintain one, you have to sacrifice the other. Unmitigated freedom of speech, or enforcable freedom of association?
Which would you all choose?
Starker on 27/6/2019 at 22:07
The way this controversy is framed is highly deceptive: is bigotry a religious freedom now that supersedes all other freedoms? If someone's religion requires them to threaten people with hell, should that then override any and all rules and terms of contract, never mind the standards of basic decency? What if someone's religion requires them to cut off the head of a goat every week, take pictures, and show them to coworkers?
Renzatic on 27/6/2019 at 22:29
Quote Posted by Starker
What if someone's religion requires them to cut off the head of a goat every week, take pictures, and show them to coworkers?
Hey, guys! I'm gonna start this club, right? Well, it's not so much a club as it is a cult, but...