Muzman on 6/8/2008 at 12:58
edit- er, to Thirith mostly
Yeah, there's usually some good changes but they come at the cost of some really awful rubbish; Newt's family find the ship and bring back the beasties? Yikes. I can't believe that got past script stage. The ending of The Abyss too. A couple of shockingly bad scenes in T2 (one where they operate on Arnie's head in an old garage, for example). It's really no accident that Titanic is his worst film and the one he had the most control over (yes Piranah is better than Titanic).
Rogue Keeper on 6/8/2008 at 13:06
More explorers from Hadley Hope, after the Jorden family, had to go to the derelict ship to bring more specimen. Otherwise I wonder how that large infestation would happen unless one of the few specimen brought back has developed into Queen.
Chimpy Chompy on 6/8/2008 at 13:06
The Newt-and-Family scene is unneccessary, but "awful rubbish" feels an exaggeration.
What was bad about the operating-on-Arnie's head scene? I liked for that moment when Sarah almost smashes the chip - ie reinforcing just how much she distrusts the terminator.
Muzman on 6/8/2008 at 13:14
The precise details of my disadain are lost in time, but I remember thinking it was obvious why they cut it given how clunky the performance and the dialogue were, plus it seemed completely unneccesary.
And the Aliens opening; Sunny Leave it to Beaver in space gives us the only survivor happening to be the daughter of the host, as it were, present at ground zero, out of all the people supposedly in this place. The whole thing is embarassingly corny.
Rogue Keeper on 6/8/2008 at 13:31
The most important reason was that it was slowing down the pacing and that the assembly cut was too long for the studio. They didn't know what scene they would take away and AFAIK it was Gale Anne Hurd's suggestion to Jim to remove this reel without compromising the plot.
Muzman on 7/8/2008 at 09:10
Because that sequence is, for me, so so wrong on every level (Aliens was a hokey enough flick compared to the first already. If it came out with that stuff at the front it would have as though from a different universe entirely. The installation is endlessly more effective a place when it's only seen as an abandoned ruin where people mysteriously aren't anymore) and because I've heard rumours of how precious Jimmy Cameron can be, particularly about effects sequences... I'm going to chalk that one up to diplomacy. Like the director who gets another take out of a prickly prima donna by claiming one of the lights in the background went out.
Oh and Primer is cool. Best indie sci-fi since Cube (I haven't seen The Signal yet)
Rogue Keeper on 7/8/2008 at 09:21
I agree it's not really necessary for the plot and it can slow down pacing, but when I like some movie, I welcome every second of precious footage from that world, that's why I hunt their special editions with restored deleted scenes which may normally look redundant or tedious in the film.
At least I can see how the colony worked and there are some good effects with Jorden tractor (it was a miniature, but properly shot it looks big).
Also you can notice that one "arm" of the derelict spaceship has collapsed since Alien 1. Perhaps consequence of atmospheric changes and corrosion coming with oxygen and rain ?
Thirith on 7/8/2008 at 10:04
For me, it goes quite a bit beyond "slowing down pacing". It made the pacing at the beginning of Aliens awkward and uneven. A story develops its own rhythm and inserting bits and pieces disrupt that rhythm. There are few exceptions, such as the Extended Editions of Lord of the Rings (to differing extents), which by and large flow better than the theatrical versions (especially Fellowship and Towers), but those weren't afterthoughts but were planned from the beginning.
Out of interest, BR###: would you have enjoyed those extra scenes just as much if they were given as deleted scenes? I'm asking because it's not that I necessarily mind the extra scenes (some more so than others), but I do think that some of them had a negative effect on the narrative. Not knowing much more than Ripley and the Marines about what has happened racks up the tension; not being introduced to Newt until they're already on the planet makes those scenes more effective; etc.
icemann on 7/8/2008 at 10:19
I really enjoyed the extra scenes in Aliens SE and Terminator 2 DC. With T2 you had the scene with Kyle for example which really should have been in the proper version and with Aliens you have the already mentioned trip to the alien vessel which explains what the catalyst was to the later eradication of the colonies inhabitants.
I wonder how long the colonists lasted against them. Considering the speed that the aliens took out all the marines, I`m assuming it wasn`t that long.
All in all I love directors cut versions to movies in either case. The Lord of the Rings directors cut versions are a must have as is the case with Blade Runner.
Rogue Keeper on 7/8/2008 at 10:21
Surely I would enjoy them separately. Some deleted scenes fit into the story while some don't, because they have no obvious connection to the rest of the story (as sometimes the script changes during shooting). This is the case of Blade Runner as well - there were some really intriguing and hypnotically shot alternate takes, but when director pushes for 30 or more takes of certain scene, just to pick up the best one in his eyes, it happens that you end with 5-10 takes which are curiously good, but they end on the floor in editing room anyway. Some outtakes can put the story in a quite different light.
These special editions/director cuts are usually aimed at limited group of fans who already saw the normal theatrical releases dozens of times and like them for how they work, but would love to see some normally unseen or alternate courses of events. And it's good that DVDs usually offer original releases as well as special editions - everybody can choose his own adventure.
However in A.D. Foster's novelization, colony/tractor scene (and other scenes not in the original release) look way more natural and actually help the narrative logic of the book.
icemann : The Final Cut is better. ;)
