bukary on 3/11/2005 at 16:08
Quote Posted by New Horizon
I'm afraid not. It's being released as is. Maybe it's a bit 'utopian' of me but I would like to see a true unification between classic Thief players and T3 players. To me that means taking the best of T3 and adjusting the weaker elements. In my own biased, humble opinion ;), the T3 hud was just not meant for a Thief game. Unfortunately, people will be forced to use a modified retro hud. I've further tweaked it since Minimalist. The compass no longer has a ring around it, so it looks much nicer now. I'm just putting the finishing tweaks on the first beta right now. I'll try to find a place to upload it for my testers. :)
I am sorry that it won't be completely to your liking, but I've been working towards this for the last year and a half. I've listened to feedback on Minimalist and have taken steps to make sure everything is as tweaked and balanced as possible. I really hope people enjoy the default settings in this version of the editor. :) No matter how hard I try, I can't think of the T3 hud as the 'original' interface. It's just not very elegant....that's not to say that what I've come up with is perfect. LOL
Sorry to hear that. I love "old" lockpicks, "old" holy water etc., but - sorry to be honest - I think that, for example, this "old" light gem from your movies is much worse that the new one. I also like weapon and item gears in TDS. And what I like ESPECIALLY is that health gems are not visible on the screen all the time. It's great improvement from T1/2!
I don't believe that such "unification between classic Thief players and T3 players" is possible. I think you should consider making it the way DromEd Deluxe was made: old features unchanged PLUS improvements. T3Ed Deluxe is rather: old features changed (possible to recover them easily?) PLUS improvements. Most of your improvements are really, really great and impressive, but I don't think that everyone will use T3Ed Deluxe - because of "holistic" and "conservative" attitude. :(
The other possible solution would be to make the list of improvements and explain everything in short tutorials. If FM author does not want to include ALL new-old features in his mission, he/she could make a good use of SOME of your discoveries. You posses priceless knowledge that might be very useful for those who will not install T3Ed Deluxe. :)
One more thing: I am not certain, but there might be a possibility that owners of TDS in other language versions will have problems with T3Ed Deluxe because of interface changes (font size, overwritten textures?)... It is important because, as you probably know, many FM authors are not from England or USA...
But at the same time I'd like to say BIG THANK YOU for all that you've done. It's incredible! :thumb:
New Horizon on 3/11/2005 at 16:33
Quote Posted by STiFU
Is there a command for frobbing? Because commands can be executed from a script and the frobcommand could be added to the "use lockpicks"-script then. This would avoid the twodoor problem.
Wouldn't worry about it. Just have to make the frob distance close enough so that it wouldn't affect the other door. The doors would have to be pretty close all the same, so I don't think it should be a problem.
New Horizon on 3/11/2005 at 16:55
Quote Posted by bukary
Sorry to hear that. I love "old" lockpicks, "old" holy water etc., but - sorry to be honest - I think that, for example, this "old" light gem from your movies is much worse that the new one. I also like weapon and item gears in TDS. And what I like ESPECIALLY is that health gems are not visible on the screen all the time. It's great improvement from T1/2!
They're not going to be exactly like the old lockpicks of course, nor are the holy water arrows exactly like the old ones. You still get the great lockpicking experience of T3 but with the added bonus of not having to worry about being sucked into it automatically. You will have much more control.
Holy water arrows are balanced differently than the originals too.
Asthetically speaking, I don't think the gem/compass combo is worse than the default T3. It may look worse to some but thief isn't necessarily about looking pretty. ;) As for the health meter...it was far too large in T3, no wonder it needed to disappear. :D In its current form, it's not nearly as intrusive and you forget it's there (it's also not as bright as the originals, the texture has an alpha layer to make it less intense). I found it really jarring to have the health meter popping up.
Quote:
I don't believe that such "unification between classic Thief players and T3 players" is possible. I think you should consider making it the way DromEd Deluxe was made: old features unchanged PLUS improvements. T3Ed Deluxe is rather: old features changed (possible to recover them easily?) PLUS improvements. Most of your improvements are really, really great and impressive, but I don't think that everyone will use T3Ed Deluxe - because of "holistic" and "conservative" attitude. :(
I'm not too concerned about winning everyone over really and it is far too late to go back and undo everything I have done. Taking the Minimalist Project into consideration, I have been working towards this for well over a year and a half of my life. I believe in it, wholeheartedly. I was never completely satisfied with T3 from day one. To me, it just didn't feel focussed and that truly bothered me. We were fed plenty of fanfare about how great it was going to be and then it wasn't. I'm not slagging the devs in any way as I realize this is likely a side effect of 'not enough time'. This project is as much for those who wanted T3 to be closer to what it could have been as it is for myself. When it's finished, I will be completely satisfied walking away from it.
It it gets used, I'm happy. If it doesn't get used, I'm still happy. :)
Quote:
The other possible solution would be to make the list of improvements and explain everything in short tutorials. If FM author does not want to include ALL new-old features in his mission, he/she could make a good use of SOME of your discoveries. You posses priceless knowledge that might be very useful for those who will not install T3Ed Deluxe. :)
I will likely release a list of all the changes sometime after I release this version of T3Ed.
Quote:
One more thing: I am not certain, but there might be a possibility that owners of TDS in other language versions will have problems with T3Ed Deluxe because of interface changes (font size, overwritten textures?)... It is important because, as you probably know, many FM authors are not from England or USA...
Shouldn't be a problem. I'm not planning to replace the font textures this time. It's far too much work. I have only scaled them down a bit.
Quote:
But at the same time I'd like to say BIG THANK YOU for all that you've done. It's incredible! :thumb:
It has been frustrating and fun at the same time. :) I'm hoping to start sleeping eight hours a night again when it's finished. I'm heading for burnout land. :laff:
STiFU on 3/11/2005 at 21:13
If you knew which files are affected by the lightgem and the healthpoints etc you could just copy them from your t3 dir and reset the concerning passages in the inis. :)
NH, could you tell me how you disabled the "new upgrade accuired"? And another thing: Did you use a custom smesh for the lockpics? Because the standard meshes are splitted in two parts (left and right lockpick) so they cant be shown at the same time in the inventory. Couldnt see it right on your video...
New Horizon on 3/11/2005 at 22:46
Quote Posted by STiFU
If you knew which files are affected by the lightgem and the healthpoints etc you could just copy them from your t3 dir and reset the concerning passages in the inis. :)
NH, could you tell me how you disabled the "new upgrade accuired"?
I went into ui.sch and searched for T_NewUpgradeAcquired. I then deleted the text between the quotation marks, making sure to leave the marks intact with a space between them.
Next was the sound. I changed the ui_complete_objective to ui_objective_complete...or maybe it was the other way around. LOL I also did this to the actual sound file and edited the text inside the ui_complete_objective file. This may lead to FM authors having to add the objective sound themselves in the triggerscript when the objective is met but it's a very small step.
Quote:
And another thing: Did you use a custom smesh for the lockpics? Because the standard meshes are splitted in two parts (left and right lockpick) so they cant be shown at the same time in the inventory. Couldnt see it right on your video...
I haven't done that yet but it's on the list of things to do. Actually, if someone with Max 5.1 could take the model for the left lockpick, clone it and position sort of...side by side, as you imagine they might look while being selected from inventory, I would greatly appreciate it. Save the name as something different like ui_lockpicks.tim and I could use that in a hud render link. If not, I'll hopefully get around to it soon. :)
Gestalt on 3/11/2005 at 23:03
Would you mind putting together a custom interface tutorial if you ever get the time? I always sort of liked the FM-specific health meters and stuff people came up with for T2 FMs, so I'd appreciate it greatly. You probably know more about tweaking the interface than anyone, so it would be greatly appreciated if you could share your expertise. I'm thinking mostly about making a custom compass/lightgem and health bar.
New Horizon on 4/11/2005 at 01:33
Quote Posted by Gestalt
Would you mind putting together a custom interface tutorial if you ever get the time? I always sort of liked the FM-specific health meters and stuff people came up with for T2 FMs, so I'd appreciate it greatly. You probably know more about tweaking the interface than anyone, so it would be greatly appreciated if you could share your expertise. I'm thinking mostly about making a custom compass/lightgem and health bar.
Yup, I'll put that on the list. :) It shouldn't really take too long as it's just 3 models.
Crispy on 4/11/2005 at 06:19
Quote Posted by New Horizon
I found it really jarring to have the health meter popping up.
I'm all for making the health appear less intrusive, but I do like the way it hides itself until you take damage. Maybe it's jarring, but getting hit with a sword will do that to you. :joke:
In all seriousness, doesn't Minimalist already do this? Surely it should be a user preference rather than a developer preference.
Quote:
Basically, if you shot a zombie, it would be hit by the holywater stim from the impact and would then be standing in a puddle of holy water that would end up killing it immediately. Doesn't give those poor shuffling bastards much of a chance now, does it? ;)
And that's how I
LIKE it. :D
STiFU on 4/11/2005 at 14:37
I have put my healthbar to the upperleft corner of the screen. If health isnt affected half of the bar is onscreen, but when you get hit it's completely onscreen. I liked it that way, but ill like the retro-healthbar, too.
I got the lockpicks running too now. Ill just have to remove the sound. The idea of editing a .sch file came to my mind too, but i didnt find it until now. Thanks for your help.
New Horizon on 4/11/2005 at 14:39
Quote Posted by STiFU
I got the lockpicks running too now. Ill just have to remove the sound now. The idea of editing a .sch file came to my mind too, but i didnt find it until now. Thanks for your help.
That's excellent. :) Glad to help.
