Salk on 1/10/2009 at 07:22
Also I openly question the respawning as game concept to build tension. The tension and immersion is built by knowing that you might have to face a danger at any time. Usually having pauses, more or less long, adds to it. The respawning concept breaks this pattern by making you sure that more enemies will somehow pop up, making it an endless and tedious wave of repetitive fighting mechanisms. The fact that the numbers of enemy is finited doesn't mean that you know when you are out of danger.
This, incidently, applies also to cinema, where few, well placed encounters scattered through the whole lenght of the movie build up tension more than a horde of zombies attacking and chasing from minute one to the end would. More, the tension rises when there are no enemies around, and not while the combat scenes are actually played.
Kolya on 1/10/2009 at 08:12
Quote Posted by Salk
Also I openly question the respawning as game concept to build tension.
Haha, you're taking this all a bit too serious, including yourself. You're just someone complaining about a game on it's fan forum. I remember when you asked first on this issue (
http://www.strangebedfellows.de/index.php/topic,8.msg2021.html#msg2021) you got friendlier answers. But apparently that didn't satisfy you.
I gave you arguments on the point I'm making and lots of other people did, here and on SBF. You just jump at the pussy calling because it's the easiest. That's not making your point stronger either. It's just a bit fun aside.
Regarding MiracleFreak's Unified & Revamped MIS mod: It's not that he isn't interested in updating it to the latest ADaoB changes, but those changes include SHEMP and that was a whole lot of work for NamelessVoice because so many monitor textures had to be realigned after the upscaling, as you already know since (
http://www.strangebedfellows.de/index.php/topic,638.msg7772.html#msg7772) you asked the same on SBF as well.
Finally, do you really think I'm patronizing you on how to play SS2? I'm merely telling you my opinion since you keep on asking about re-spawning. It's not like I or anyone else here could force you how to play. And I think I've done a lot already to allow people to play SS2 as they like, including trying to help and explain this to you several times now. What have you done?
It just seems to me by now that you see this as an occasion to tell everyone about what you think constitutes a great game. That's what (
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=74) General Gaming is for. We're here because we think SS2 is a great game. And you're just not getting it, because you think in gaming concepts, instead of going into this with an open mind.
Matthew on 1/10/2009 at 09:12
Quote Posted by Salk
Let me quote from Wikipedia:
"
Enemy respawning...
System Shock 2 and
Doom 3, in particular, have been alternately lauded or derided for these features by players and reviewers alike."
[Citation Needed]
[Original Research?]
Salk on 1/10/2009 at 09:48
Yes, perhaps I am taking it a bit too seriously but 1) I am not complaining about then game (I am just saying I don't like one feature of it) 2) I have always expressed politely my opinions. Including here.
Quote:
I gave you arguments on the point I'm making and lots of other people did, here and on SBF. You just jump at the pussy calling because it's the easiest. That's not making your point stronger either. It's just a bit fun aside.
Despite enjoying the Monty Pytons and the Marx Brothers I might not have a well developed sense of humor so I don't see how you are having fun in this but said that, I am still failing to see what arguments you and the others gave. I counterdebated the "takes off tension" and/or "you are supposed to be scared all the time" with my own argumentations. What else is it left?
Quote:
Regarding MiracleFreak's Unified & Revamped MIS mod: It's not that he isn't interested in updating it to the latest ADaoB changes, but those changes include SHEMP and that was a whole lot of work for NamelessVoice because so many monitor textures had to be realigned after the upscaling, as you already know since (
http://www.strangebedfellows.de/index.php/topic,638.msg7772.html#msg7772) you asked the same on SBF as well.
I knew that NamelessVoice and ZB have been working on that but I didn't know that it might have an impact on MiracleFreak's mod. Also, since you are providing links, I can as well provide two more: (
http://www.strangebedfellows.de/index.php/topic,638.msg7772.html#msg7772) here and (
http://www.strangebedfellows.de/index.php/topic,25.msg7924.html#msg7924) here where I didn't get any answer. Does that justify me asking the same in here?
Quote:
Finally, do you really think I'm patronizing you on how to play SS2? I'm merely telling you my opinion since you keep on asking about re-spawning. It's not like I or anyone else here could force you how to play. And I think I've done a lot already to allow people to play SS2 as they like, including trying to help and explain this to you several times now. What have you done?
I have simply asked if there was a way to disable respawning from the game. It was not me starting the debate, Kolya. Once the debated started I felt I should partecipate, since I was "reprimended" for having a different idea. The way I was addressed was certainly condescending.
Quote:
It just seems to me by now that you see this as an occasion to tell everyone about what you think constitutes a great game. That's what (
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=74) General Gaming is for. We're here because we think SS2 is a great game. And you're just not getting it, because you think in gaming concepts, instead of going into this with an open mind.
Er... I am not sure I understand what you mean with "you're just not getting it, because you think in gaming concepts, instead of going into this with an open mind.". It's true that I take this opportunity to state why respawning is a ludicrous idea in itself. But since respawning applies to System Shock 2, I don't think I am off topic. Mostly if considering again that it was not me starting this discussion. I had simply asked a question. I got many answers, but I am still at the starting point.
Salk on 1/10/2009 at 09:50
Quote Posted by Matthew
[Citation Needed]
[Original Research?]
Sorry for having omitted it.
Here it is: (
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Respawn) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Respawn
kaos2110 on 1/10/2009 at 14:45
I can't help but notice that the ever un-biased and accurate Wikipedia has failed to cite sources for this 'derision'.
Salk on 1/10/2009 at 14:48
Quote Posted by kaos2110
I can't help but notice that the ever un-biased and accurate Wikipedia has failed to cite sources for this 'derision'.
I can assure you that it's not been an entry of mine... ;)
Kolya on 1/10/2009 at 15:14
Quote Posted by Salk
I knew that NamelessVoice and ZB have been working on that but I didn't know that it might have an impact on MiracleFreak's mod.
Well if you open the link again and then go to the next page of that thread you'll find that Nameless answered as much.
Quote Posted by Salk
I am still failing to see what arguments you and the others gave. I counterdebated the "takes off tension" and/or "you are supposed to be scared all the time" with my own argumentations. What else is it left?
Nothing really. Most people think that re-spawning is an important part of SS2. But if you don't like it you have the option to turn it off for the most part. Just not in combination with the latest version of ADaoB. And for technical reasons that's not likely to change soon.
Salk on 1/10/2009 at 15:24
Quote Posted by Kolya
Most people think that re-spawning is an important part of SS2. But if you don't like it you have the option to turn it off for the most part. Just not in combination with the latest version of ADaoB. And for technical reasons that's not likely to change soon.
Thanks!
I had hoped that disabling respawns might have been as easy as changing an entry of an .ini file.
I do realize that most of you guys believe that the respawning is a key feature of the game. I might as well learn from your experience and give it a run with it, trying not to be prejudiced.
