icemann on 30/10/2007 at 12:48
Kolya: I`m curious. Why were you expecting a big storyline with Portal? Puzzle games generally are very light on storylines and tend to focus more on the puzzles at hand, which is exactly what Portal does.
Personally thats all I was expecting from the moment I first played it. Though if storyline / background is what your after you have only to pay attention to the scenery in the game. Theres a few spots that give clear indications of where you are and what has happened.
For me the puzzles was all I was after. The rest was secondary. I found the cake jokes hilarious and the song at the end topped it all off :).
Even reading your earlier example of the statement "I'm going to murder you! And you were like: No way! That was fun." had me laughing just remembering that moment in the game. GlaDos was a completely insane AI. Insane AI`s aren`t supposed to make sense. Thats why their insane in the first place. Also on the comment about her/it making jokes all the time, I recall that being a very common trait in crazy people.
I completely agree though on the puzzles ending just as they were starting to get good. There are the advanced puzzles, but those are just rehashes of existing ones, only harder.
Dont be surprised if you see the portal gun pop up in HL2 at some point. Man that gun would be useful + fun to use. Most revolutionary weapon I`ve seen in a game that I can think of.
Firefreak on 30/10/2007 at 13:49
Quote Posted by icemann
There are the advanced puzzles, but those are just rehashes of existing ones, only harder.
harder? The challenges are quite some difficult puzzles -- I could make some with least portals, but the shortest time and least-step challenges...
(Anyone care to tell me how to easily solve the companion-cube-puzzle with only 2 portals? 3 worked for me, but 2... :sweat: )
Kolya on 30/10/2007 at 16:18
Quote Posted by icemann
Kolya: I`m curious. Why were you expecting a big storyline with Portal?
Because I'm dumb. Seriously, I've answered that before: Comparisons with Thief and System Shock 2 made up my expectations. I didn't expect a "big storyline" as I had heard the game was short, but a credible one.
I've meanwhile read that Portal was originally a students project named "Narbacular Drop". The same students remade their game for Valve and this explained a lot for me. Namely why Portal tries to be so clever and ironic about gaming (instead of just telling a story) and why the scenery is so bland. In certain academic designer circles big white planes and pictograms (reduction) are still all the rage, and ironic self-referentiality is regarded as cool postmodern deconstruction of the subject. I think it's masturbation.
Portal is a game made to discuss it: Mise en Abyme, 4th wall, pseudo social relationships, reward systems, the gamer's reflection(!) of himself in the game world, etc. Name the concept and it's been punched in your face already. Only this sort of representation makes them useless, if you know the concepts.
Games like Thief, System Shock and HL2 create the illusion of another world and tell a story about it. This is much harder to achieve but that's the sort of game I want to play. The same concepts are all there, working in the background. And if I feel the need I can think about them later. But they don't break into the game.
Now maybe someone will say: "You're approaching this way too theoretical! It's just a very fun game."
If that is so for you, then you're right. Enjoy it. :)
ZylonBane on 30/10/2007 at 16:55
Quote Posted by Kolya
In certain academic designer circles big white planes and pictograms (reduction) are still all the rage, and ironic self-referentiality is regarded as cool postmodern deconstruction of the subject. I think it's masturbation.
You're still refusing to acknowledge that most of Portal is LITERALLY set in a testing facility, then? That's what test facilities tend to actually look like, you know. Simple, minimalistic, no unnecessary equipment.
Kolya on 30/10/2007 at 17:06
No, that's just one possible (and in any case fictional) representation of a testing facility. Take any other dev team or just another game engine and it would look significantly different.
Let alone that no one forced them to let the game take place in such a facility. So that was design decision too.
Spaztick on 30/10/2007 at 20:22
Quote Posted by Firefreak
Only harder? The challenges are quite some difficult puzzles -- I could make some with least portals, but the shortest time and least-step challenges...
(Anyone care to tell me how to easily solve the companion-cube-puzzle with only 2 portals? 3 worked for me, but 2... :sweat: )
[SPOILER]The first energy ball dispenser shoots out balls even if it's been used. As for only 2 portals, you have to hit the ball into the 2nd slot with the companion cube to not use 3 portals.[/SPOILER]
Firefreak on 30/10/2007 at 20:45
Spaztick, thanks for the info about the [spoiler]first dispenser[/spoiler]. :thumb: That's something I didn't expect nor think of to test it - or never would have, which is why I don't like such puzzles where my frustration kicks in before ultra-creative thoughts rise...
the_grip on 31/10/2007 at 04:11
i just finished Portal last night and was extremely surprised at how short it was.
This was definitely a clever experiment... i hesitate to even call this a game b/c it really feels like a comedic experiment. There was no "fun" factor to it per se - i.e. i'm not relishing the gameplay much. There really was not any puzzle solving to speak of, either (unless you are maybe twelve).
All that said, the story was extremely quirky, creepy, and hilarious at the same time. To boot, the song during the final credits is worth the price of three games. i was laughing so hard at that point.
The only real downside i have with Portal is the computerized voice. It is EXTREMELY annoying. A better computerized voice would be, well, better. It doesn't coincide with the game well to me.
i imagine i'll hit this one again to capture all the one liners. The sophistication in the level of dialog (i.e. how much of it and how varied it is in the game) reminds me of the random NPC dialog in Thief. i know Portal is not random in dialog, but there is so much rich chatter from the she-bitch-computer that it warrants hearing it again (despite the grating voice).
This is not the most "fun" i've had in a long time, but it is definitely one of the more memorable and interesting times i've had recently.
Spaztick on 31/10/2007 at 06:04
Quote Posted by Firefreak
Spaztick, thanks for the info about the [spoiler]first dispenser[/spoiler]. :thumb: That's something I didn't expect nor think of to test it - or never would have, which is why I don't like such puzzles where my frustration kicks in before ultra-creative thoughts rise...
I stumbled upon it accidentally, but it made me think how to accomplish something other than flinging portals everywhere and what alternate methods there were. Essentially I had to think about the solution and then work backwards to find the problem; you're already given that the solution is 2 portals, and if you can find where to place them and never move them again based on whatever else you have to do such as [SPOILER]needing multiple balls with 2 portals, or having to get back to the top so you can jump on the platforms to the exit.[/SPOILER] In short thinking another way to solve a problem without portals helped a lot.
If you can solve the least portals puzzles then the rest become easier (except for least steps, those are a pain to do).
Firefreak on 31/10/2007 at 06:38
Quote Posted by Spaztick
(except for least steps, those are a pain to do).
I get that they're the direct opposite to least portals.
Even placing a portal under your feet is counted as one step (to be precise: the immediate landing is) and jumping counts as two...
Crazy idea alert: It should be possible to finish a level just by flinging - now
that is a challenge, finishing a puzzle with only four steps (two out of and two into the elevators :p momentum properly applied and you might not even need the last two steps.)
