Baron Bifford on 29/4/2006 at 18:50
I've heard that a bunch of Spanish singers have released a Spanish translation of the Star-Spangled Banner, aimed at Latin-Americans and illegal immigrants alike. A lot of people (Bush included) think this is wrong and unpatriotic. I, on the other hand, approve.
I don't approve of it because of my stance on illegal immigration (that's another matter I won't touch right now). I approve of it because such things help communicate American values to foreigners. Let's face it, America hasn't done a good job of marketing itself in the past few years. It may have killed some terrorists, but the geopolitical backlash is going to cost it in the long run. America needs to show the world what is good about its country. This can be very powerful. Let's not forget that the French Revolution was in part inspired by the American Revolution.
At the heart of America lies an ideal, not a language.
Gingerbread Man on 29/4/2006 at 19:00
Far as I'm concerned, the real issue with this Nuestro Himno thing is that the song absolutely SUCKS. It sounds terrible, the singing is awful, the musical arrangement is just crap.
I do understand the language debate, and that's one the Americans are going to have to deal with for a while -- along with all kinds of other things to do with the Spanish-speaking populations in the USA, mainly because SOMEONE started yattering on about guest worker amnesty or something equally ill-advised, so now there's a ton of people all riled up because they had something dangled in front of them that doesn't look like it's ever going to materialise. Not that any of the rest of us ever believed it would, but maybe it's a good lesson for politicians to leave certain cans of worms undisturbed no matter how lucrative a political move they think it might be. Faggots.
But living up here is a different, though similar, thing... And not even concerning French. We have a huge population of immigrants who make no effort to learn English (or French, for that matter, but seriously... who speaks French west of Ottawa?) and it makes a huge problem in terms of civil services having to hire all kinds of extra people who speak Farsi or Mandarin or Tagalog or whatever. Plus it's just an impediment to their integration as citizens which, okay that's their right I suppose to come to another country and then isolate and alienate themselves so that they never get a chance to fully appreciate the things they came here to be part of, but ngngngnngnnn
I won't get on that horse. It doesn't lead anywhere pleasant.
On topic, however, I think the OMFG SPANISH BLASPHEMY reaction is understandable but unnecessary. The important point is that the song as recorded is FUCKING AWFUL. Like "I can't listen to this shit" awful. Honestly.
Agent Monkeysee on 29/4/2006 at 19:08
My understanding is the language issue is completely overblown anyway. Some ridiculous majority of 2nd generation immigrants, like 98% or something, either speak English or are bilingual. It's almost like the children of immigrants are *gasp* naturalizing.
demagogue on 29/4/2006 at 19:42
Such a bizarre turn of events. Bush owes his original success in the 1990s as Texas governor and even for his 2004 reelection to a substantial (Catholic, middle class, homophobic) Latino following -- largest Latino vote for a Rep ever; in 2008 they flooded Latino neighborhoods with anti-gay-marriage pamphlets. In Texas he regularly gave speeches in Spanish. The immigration issue is on the rise for 2008 because the Christian Coalition agenda is pretty much a dying-dinosaur (the 1994- Gingrich/Armey/DeLay era is officially over now that DeLay is out), so they move to another golden oldie standby: nativism :mad:
Also the multiculturalism of Democrats is also apparently on its way out, giving way to populism (goodbye Jessie Jackson, hello Truman), so they aren't running to the immigrants' defense as fast.
Apparently there's been a seachange somewhere along the way, and the Rep leadership can be pretty uncanny in reading the pulse of the heartland, although I can't feel it here in NYC of course and find the anti-immigrant rhetoric a little troubling... But it's true that if nothing else came out of 9/11, it galvanized the country into rallying around certain *shared national values*...
Anyway, the NYTimes had a good editorial in favor of the illegal immigrant protests noting how desparately many of them want to join in the American dream if they could have the chance. It ended with a Spanish pledge of alliegence that protesters could read that put their yearning into words. You have to admit it's striking, whether you're sympathetic or this is exactly what you're afraid of:
Ai plech aliyens
Tu da fleg
Of de Yunaited Estates of America
An tu de republik
For wich it estands.
Uan nashion, under Gad
Indivisibol,
Wit libertie an yostice
For oll.
Wyclef on 29/4/2006 at 22:43
More like the Star Spanglish Banner
Mr.Duck on 29/4/2006 at 22:58
:cool:
Ai los wacho, homies!
Tenkahubu on 29/4/2006 at 23:08
Quote:
Originally posted by Gingerbread Manmaybe it's a good lesson for politicians to leave certain cans of worms undisturbed no matter how lucrative a political move they think it might be. Faggots.
Would Gay bashing be another example of that?
Although I`m not from the US and havent seen the whole picture, this just seems bigoted. It`s not as if English is in danger of dying out is it?
I think that the US could use some genuine diversity, I meet so many Americans that go around saying "I`m Scottish" or "I`m Italian". It`s absolute bullshit. There`s nothing about them that is of the country they say. What they mean is that one of their ancestors was from that place, it`s like necromantic multi-culturalism. This Spanish recording, at heart, seems like little more than an attempt to celebrate genuine diversity.
If a Hindi, Urdu or other version of `God save the Queen` was released, I think most people in Britain would see the fun side. The Sex Pistol`s version was very popular. Maybe we have a little more freedom of speech? However, if you said "The national anthem ought to be sung in English. And I think people who want to be citizens of this country ought to learn it in English. They ought to learn to sing the national anthem in English" in Britain, I think you would probably be declared a Nazi bastard. Isn`t Nationalism a negative word in the US yet?
Aerothorn on 29/4/2006 at 23:09
I think the Star Spangled Banner should only be sung in languages I don't understand, it might be less nauseating then.
Ko0K on 29/4/2006 at 23:18
Singing it the way it is would seem like more of an effort to become American, if you ask me. Then again, I didn't really think it was such a big deal when I learned of this. Most likely it'll blow over in time. It would seem that each person's attitude toward this depends on his/her pre-existing views on illegal immigration.
I saw the interview with the great great grandson of the guy who composed the anthem, and apparently he's against it. That probably won't stop the local Latino radio stations from airing it, though.
demagogue on 29/4/2006 at 23:43
People freaked out at Roseanne Barr's vulgar rendition of the song ... and I remember thinking the critics were going a little overboard.
On reflection, while undoutably immigration has a lot to do with this, I wonder if a lot of it is also that weird sensitivity some people (Republicans) have to the purity of the song (and flag, and national monuments, etc.)
Like we know we can't trust the government anymore, but at least we can still have faith in our trusty, silent, never-changing national symbololgy. But on the other hand, they're "symbols" ... they can stand for all sorts of things, even to immigrants.
