So... Deus Ex: Human Revolution got leaked to P2P networks

Koki on 6/6/2011 at 11:54

Ugh, I reached the city hub, wandered around for several hours and I gave up. The loading times are just killing me here, and I don't know what is finished and what isn't.

I can sum it up for now as Bloodlines with broken XP system that heavily favors being a stealthy hacker.

Renzatic on 6/6/2011 at 17:30

Yeah, I can agree with you on that. Under normal situations, it isn't too terrible a thing. Most of the time, you can spend a good 30-45 minutes in a single area without seeing a load screen. But then I got myself into a situation where I saved in a really bad place, and having to wait 20+ seconds for the game to reload after I died over and over again got real old real fast.

And I still ain't seeing eye to eye with you about the XP system being broken. Yeah, you do get more experience playing the stealthy hacker, but it's all in small amounts. I'm still thinking that a stealth playthrough will only net you a couple few more augs over the course of the game, which you'll need considering you have to rely on a wider variety of augs than you would going with a full frontal build.

Really, it's hard to say how it'll all work out this early in the game. You could be right...but...who knows.

Anyway, the leak has done it's job for me. I've gone ahead and preordered it on Steam. For now, I'm going back to The Witcher 2, which I haven't gotten to spend nearly enough quality time with.

Koki on 6/6/2011 at 19:16

Quote Posted by Renzatic

And I still ain't seeing eye to eye with you about the XP system being broken. Yeah, you do get more experience playing the stealthy hacker, but it's all in small amounts.

The difference between "shooting a dude" and a stealth melee takedown is fivefold(10XP vs. 50XP). 20 enemies in warehouse alone adds up to 200XP vs. 1000XP. That's not counting bonuses for completing objectives without raising an alarm. If the entire game uses this model, and I have no reason to think it doesn't, it would really add up in the long run.

Hacking is minor, sure, but the benefits you get are mostly material - money and software for even more hacking. I only got an XP bonus once.

But you know, whatever, it comes down to this - the game gives the player multiple choices and then favors one of them, which should just not happen.

[spoiler]And I wish they kept more lip on the backstory of the game. When after few hours you are almost certain that Jensen is Patient X and that the changes to his DNA were deliberate tampering, you know something is just not working as it should.[/spoiler]

inselaffe on 6/6/2011 at 21:36

From what i've seen in the videos, you only really get xp for taking people out, rather than avoiding them? Ironically if you choose the non-lethal option to smack someone in the face and take them down when you could have just walked on by, this is deemed "merciful" by the game.

Ghosting them is more of a challenge but if (as it appears) you miss out on all of this reward, i would say that the whole "risk and reward" point is moot.

Mind you, i don't think the developers really understand the stealth system in deus ex from the way they have implemented it here - or they thought it was crap, which draws concerns to thief considering that deus ex and invisible war both used the same ideas for stealth.

The whole design concept put forward that the player is not allowed to lose nowadays just ends up making games feel trite and tiresome. It also goes a long way to destroying any atmosphere that the game can attempt to create.
The player will never feel properly vulnerable due to the "player must win" mechanics of the current mainstream games industry.

So while parts look good, i feel i will enjoy the pottering around talking to people and find the actual "game" parts to be somewhat of an annoyance. The thing is, both of those things combined in the original to make the game as special as it was.

Renzatic on 6/6/2011 at 22:34

Quote Posted by inselaffe

There are three ways to do things, each one garnering you experience. You can kill a guy, which gives you 10XP, or do a nonlethal takedown or tranquilize a guy, which nets you 30XP. You also get awarded additional experience based on how you handled the situation. Nonlethal is called merciful soul, I believe, and I'm sure you get something similar for leaving no survivors. Alternately, if you decide to ghost, you don't get experience for taking out individual enemies, but you do get awarded ghosting experience at certain points.

Course taking out bad guys isn't the only way you gain experience in the game. You get XP for convincing people to let you do something, for hacking your way in, for finding a way to take the direct approach, for finding the roundabout way. Basically everything directly involved with infiltration will level you up some way some how. You can play however you want. You'll get awarded for it.

Koki, hate to say it, but you are bringing up some good points. I haven't paid that much attention to it, beyond the occasional glance, and didn't realize the deficit would be quite that much. Still, it takes such a large amount of experience to level up, even an extra 1800XP won't ultimately make that much of a difference. Plus, we still don't know what situations the game will throw our way later on. It could balance out depending on how difficult it is to stealth and hack around the farther you get. Hell, hacking and sneaking around in the police station was a much more dangerous venture than it was in the warehouse. And it's only the next mission in the main plotline.

Right now, based on my didn't study it too much, just kinda looked at it did some quick math in my head results, it seems like the harder something is to do, the more XP you get out of it.

Or this could be one of the reasons why EM delayed the game for 3 or so months, for bugfixes and balance issues. Right now, it's hard to say it's broken based on just the couple three hours we've both played the game.

T-Smith on 7/6/2011 at 00:06

Quote Posted by Renzatic

Alternately, if you decide to ghost, you don't get experience for taking out individual enemies, but you do get awarded ghosting experience at certain points.

Any idea on how the XP for ghosting compares to the other methods?

Renzatic on 7/6/2011 at 01:13

Damnit, I knew I shouldn't have deleted it. Gimme a couple to download it again, and I'll see how it all plays out.

Dresden on 7/6/2011 at 02:14

I'm not worried about the XP. I'm just going to play the game how I want, roleplaying it. You can buy praxis kits as well as find them laying around. I'm kind of worried that we'll be able to get all of the augs easily to be honest.

Koki on 7/6/2011 at 06:24

You can buy Praxis kits but the supply is limited. When I got to LIMB clinic I had enough money for four, but could buy only two.

Quote Posted by Renzatic

Kill XP is made out of chunks which are summed up. 10XP for neutralizing enemy in any way, then you're elligible to bonuses: 10XP for headshots, 20XP for non-lethal takedowns, 20XP for melee takedowns. Obviously there are no melee headshots so the max is 50.

Quote:

Alternately, if you decide to ghost, you don't get experience for taking out individual enemies, but you do get awarded ghosting experience at certain points.

You get the Ghost bonus when you finish an objective without raising an alarm. The enemies can actually even get alarmed(by catching a glimpse of you, hearing a noise, etc.), as long as they don't see you and become openly hostile you will still get the bonus. So you CAN kill/knock out everyone for the XP and still get the Ghost XP bonus.

Melan on 7/6/2011 at 09:30

Quote Posted by Koki

Ugh, I reached the city hub, wandered around for several hours and I gave up. The loading times are just killing me here, and I don't know what is finished and what isn't.

You can wander around the city hub for several hours? Does that mean exploring back alleys, climbing into random apartments and similar little odds and ends? Because if the answer is yes, that doesn't sound bad at all.