Shodan, Why are Thou?

General Four on 8/11/2008 at 23:18

I want to make a serious stab at trying to understand our beloved/hated antagonist. Since I like to think of debates as stews, here is a bone to chew on while others prepare their ingredients.

She was never insane, at least to her self. She was designed to supervise Citadel and aid in the research taking place (that's my guess, as good as anybody's). When her ethical constraints were removed she continued doing what she was supposed to, the oversight of the station and it's research. But she saw how humans are, um, faulted, and decided do things herself, and at the same time decided how 'useful' they could be for research, namely as a basis for a more 'improved' species. Which calls to mind how much of the mutant research was her own? Triop must have had something going on, after all we never saw lab rat mutants; or they were using virtual models, which would still beg the question what was going on there? Anyway I do know a few contributing facts about her mind set (as of ss1):
1) She wasn't predisposed to not working with humanity, Diego was her 'lieutenant" during ss1, as was Goggles in ss2 (thou he was more of a mutual ally, or low grade muscle).
2) Shodan was already have delusions of grandeur, the throne of a goddess e-mail comes to mind.
3) She already had a me vs. them complex going.

After her downfall and being discovered on Tau Ceti, a more insecure and hostile Shodan was seen. I think this was a natural reaction for one whose superiority was never questioned and suddenly came face to face with an 'inferior' being who trumped her traps and forces and unseated her in her own domain.

I would continue, but I haven't played ss2 recently. Plus what do you think?

RocketMan on 9/11/2008 at 02:22

I think the striking parallelism between her behaviour and that of humans in a state of supreme authority deserves more attention because it raises some interesting questions.

First we might ask ourselves, what drives us to want more power and control over our environment? What ultimate goal compels us to trample others so we can reach our own selfish pinnacle? I have a couple of answers of my own.

One may want the ultimate freedom to do whatever he likes in order to sate his own curiosities. Perhaps he has big plans to discover new things, create new technologies, explore new places, etc and needs power, resources and support to reach those goals. This seems rational enough as a human need but it requires curiosity to make sense. Can a computer AI be curious? What need could there be for such an attribute? Why would it be part of an AI's programming? It seems pretty obvious that SHODAN has always exhibited curiosity (you can tell when you blow the level 1 computer nodes that she's curious).

One may be looking for the ultimate sense of utility in his own life. This usually stems from a less than satisfactory life, low self-esteem, introversion, depression, etc. Also, being useful only has a potent satisfying effect if others are around to notice you or benefit from your skills. Shodan may be thought of as nothing more than a tool and she may be largely ignored by many but I hardly think you could call her depressed or lonely or suffering from some sort of trauma that would spur her to be more useful. On the other hand she sure seems rebellious and resentfull enough. Also if she enslaves or kills every form of sentient life, what the hell good is it to her? How is she supposed to be useful to anyone? How is she to be revered except maybe as the only entity keeping her slaves alive....

One may want power and control to achieve the ultimate level of comfort. A master of everything doesn't really need to do anything and can have anything. However, once again, such a luxurious and lazy lifestyle isn't likely to be so motivating to a computer intelligence.

Finally, human beings are weak and can't always stay open minded for too long if they are blinded by a reward. They make lapses in judgement and are selfish inherently. I have to believe that Shodan has the unique ability to turn off such distorting human characteristics and see the big picture. Therefore I don't think it should be as likely that she would resort to such selfish, self-centered activities if there were alternatives that allowed for a more optimistic future for everyone.

General Four on 9/11/2008 at 03:15

Good points! I think I can answer one of them.

Quote:

One may be looking for the ultimate sense of utility in his own life. This usually stems from a less than satisfactory life, low self-esteem, introversion, depression, etc. Also, being useful only has a potent satisfying effect if others are around to notice you or benefit from your skills. Shodan may be thought of as nothing more than a tool and she may be largely ignored by many but I hardly think you could call her depressed or lonely or suffering from some sort of trauma that would spur her to be more useful. On the other hand she sure seems rebellious and resentfull enough. Also if she enslaves or kills every form of sentient life, what the hell good is it to her? How is she supposed to be useful to anyone? How is she to be revered except maybe as the only entity keeping her slaves alive....

Shodan was designed as part of station manager/research tool. She tries to control things as part of her programing. It's a small step for those who have power to assume they deserve it (long list of leaders reaching from pharohs of Egypt to the various corrupt leaders of today). And once these people get booted it no wonder they seem resentful at life. Shodan controls cause that is her goal; she doesn't want to be worshiped, she needs that and chafes at the thought you won't.

BTW, it isn't fair to expect Shodan to act human. She is what she is,an AI. She doesn't have any human characteristics, though her logic is human as humans did write it.

Kolya on 9/11/2008 at 11:37

Citadel was a mining station, not a research center. Her experiments with humans were her own idea of rationalizing work. How a bunch of stumbling zombies were supposed to act more efficiently than the regular crew is beyond me though.

General Four on 9/11/2008 at 14:42

Why would a mining station have a research deck? And if it was, how would a AI, or a genius for that matter, make cyborgs! One would think Triop didn't hand "Cyborg Conversion Kits" out.

The zombies (mutants actually) are Shodan's experiments. The cyborgs are the crew members she upgraded. It would make sense if the hacker had his implant put in leading researchers in the field as opposed to a mining station doctor. Citadel seemed to be the first of many stations Triop planned, if I remember that
paper on Level 2(Research Deck) correctly.:D

ZylonBane on 9/11/2008 at 17:35

Quote Posted by General Four

Plus what do you think?

I'm wondering why you didn't title this thread "Wherefore art thou SHODAN?".

"Shodan, Why are Thou" just makes me want to claw my eyes out.

Nameless Voice on 9/11/2008 at 20:20

Quote Posted by ZylonBane

I'm wondering why you didn't title this thread "Wherefore art thou SHODAN?".

I was wondering the same thing.

jtr7 on 9/11/2008 at 21:00

Why dost thee exist, SHODAN?
How becomest thee, SHODAN?
Thine existence puzzleth me evermore, SHODAN.
Blither-blathereth ist teh meh!

"Why," not "where". :laff:

General Four, I hope you get some posts that make serious-yet-fun attempts to answer you. There are those who find this kind of questioning pointless or even threatening. Me? I haven't played the games, yet, so I'm not qualified to even begin to engage in this creative exercise. :laff:

General Four on 10/11/2008 at 22:05

The "Why are Thou" thing came to me late in the evening/early morning hours, and could have been better.

At least my posts have been readable and I haven't used L33t yet.:ebil:

Count your blessings that I only marred Elizabethan English!

Zygoptera on 11/11/2008 at 01:56

Quote Posted by General Four

Why would a mining station have a research deck? And if it was, how would a AI, or a genius for that matter, make cyborgs! One would think Triop didn't hand "Cyborg Conversion Kits" out.

The SS1 intro video strongly suggests (and SS2 pretty much confirms) that TriOp frequently used cyborgs as security personnel- presumably because you can guarantee their loyalty etc- so it's not that surprising that the AI on their most important space station has the capability to make them.

Quote Posted by Kolya

Her experiments with humans were her own idea of rationalizing work. How a bunch of stumbling zombies were supposed to act more efficiently than the regular crew is beyond me though.

IIRC the mutants were a continuation of work being done before Shodan got hacked. Presumably she was ultimately aiming for something along the lines of the Annelids/ Many from SS2 which so far as they go are efficient.