Kingers on 18/3/2005 at 15:04
7Zip integration is in! Thanks to Durinda D'Bry but I had already discovered the command line tool. 7Zip will now be the default! :thumb:
On another note you cannot create ActiveX with .NET I think you are referring to assemblies. Besides the DarkLoader code is in Delphi and I would have no idea where to begin.
Regardless the first request is in! :joke:
van HellSing on 18/3/2005 at 15:14
I'd change the name. FleshLoader sounds too kinky :p.
Shadowspawn on 18/3/2005 at 15:15
I'm not concerned about integrating with existing Darkloader. Everyone has separate installations for T2 and T3, so why not another program. It's not like you have a common launcher for T2 and T3, so why use the same program to manage the FMs?
If there is ZIP support build into .NET, I'd use it and forget 7-zip. If you have to build support for ZIP, then I'd look into 7-zip. Or, build it so it can detect and use the right component, you could make ActiveX components (or COM) to decompress the file once you know what it is. I'm not convinced 7-zip is the save all everyone seems to think it is, we went through this a few years ago with RAR.
Yes, missions are going to be big. Dial-up users get screwed. Is 7-zip going to fix all that? No, it makes the files a little smaller, but you're still going to be downloading for hours.
Maybe someone who's pushing 7-zip can write the ActiveX control to unzip the files and work with Kingers to integrate it.
Kingers, thanks for taking this on. I'm glad someone stepped up to the plate on this one. There's only a few of us who write tools, welcome to the club. (Oh, and expect that few people will be happy with whatever you develop.) :thumb:
SneaksieDave on 18/3/2005 at 18:36
Quote Posted by Kingers
7Zip is a possibility however I will have to see if someone has written a free .NET library for the format...
Is that to say use of FleshLoader will require the .NET framework installed? If so, boo, hiss, in advance.
7Zip support yes, but please not exclusive. Unless of course it requires the .NET framework in which case it won't matter to me, much. :erg:
Kingers on 18/3/2005 at 19:53
[SneaksieDave] I am sorry to say that the .NET Framework is the future and its crazy to think that you won't need it in the future and it's not as though a one time 20MB download is that big!
[Shadowspawn] ZIP unfortunately is not part of .NET (which is annoying but SharpZip can fulfill all needs) but I am going to use an excellent command line utility for 7z. It will probably be the default format but ZIP is supported by the utility as well so no probs there and everyone is happy :cheeky:
[van HellSing] This name reflects the Thief: DS engine which was named Flesh hence FleshLoader while Thief 1, Gold & 2 where built on the DARK engine hence the name DarkLoader.
David on 18/3/2005 at 20:00
Does the 7zip command line tool allow you to view the contents of the archive programatically without extracting it? If not, how do you propose to find out the "Fan Mission Details" from your first screenshot?
In fact, I don't believe command line extractors should be used. The main reason being that you don't know what you're extracting for the most part.
Darkloader, for example, will not extract anything executable. (EXE, DLL etc) How do plan on supporting this necessary security?
OrbWeaver on 18/3/2005 at 20:58
Quote Posted by David
Does the 7zip command line tool allow you to view the contents of the archive programatically without extracting it? If not, how do you propose to find out the "Fan Mission Details" from your first screenshot?
If I were implementing this, I would specify a text file that must be included in the archive, e.g. MANIFEST.TXT, which would contain whatever details were required for the loader screen. This single file could then be extracted when the archive was "probed", to populate whatever fields needed to be shown.
Quote:
In fact, I don't believe command line extractors should be used. The main reason being that you don't know what you're extracting for the most part.
Darkloader, for example, will not extract anything executable. (EXE, DLL etc) How do plan on supporting this necessary security?
I can't immediately see how command line extractors would be any worse than DLL-based extractors in this regard. Extracting files to a temporary directory, moving the "acceptable" ones into the Thief3 folder and deleting anything suspicious ought to prevent malicious code from being executed.
SneaksieDave on 18/3/2005 at 22:23
Quote Posted by Kingers
[SneaksieDave] I am sorry to say that the .NET Framework is the future and its crazy to think that you won't need it in the future and it's not as though a one time 20MB download is that big!
Is that right? Hm. I was under the impression (from several apps directing me to download) that it was a 100+Mb download. Do you have a link to exactly what is required?
{soapbox}
The only reason .NET is the future, is because we the people allow it to be! FIGHT the power, don't endorse it!
{/soapbox}
There's always zlib, winrar, and C++ for the concerns raised.
Mandrake on 19/3/2005 at 05:44
ACK.
PLEASE don't use .net framework to write fleshloader. Every single program I've used based on .net framework has been buggy bloated crap :erg:
There is no need whatsoever to use something like .net framework for something as simple as this, you're well into bulldozer to carry an egg territory if you do :cheeky:
Can't say I'm that excited by the name "Fleshloader" either. While hardcore Thief3 / map builders will get the joke, others will probably just think it is bad taste....
Of course there is nothing to say that there will only ever be one "Fleshloader", someone may come along and write another one, or perhaps Darkloader will get updated to support Thief3.
I think the main thing is that those who are far enough advanced in the map editing/hacking area get together and work out exactly what files need distributing and modifying to get maps to play in non editor installs (with the standard executable as well) and once that information is well documented, a number of "fleshloaders" may spring up.
At the moment we know what files are needed just to run a standard map, but custom scripts, custom meshes, textures, and so on havn't been fully worked out for distribution yet AFAIK.
