Judith on 12/6/2020 at 07:21
Quote Posted by icemann
Example of tribalism right there. When you surround yourself only with views you agree on. Thus strengthening your own views since you never debate or hear/read counterpoints.
I'm afraid it's something far less intellectual here. It was a simple time saver. Just in terms of e.g. the movie thread, you tend to praise poor, average or pulpy stuff while downplaying or just scratching the surface of better works (both in my opinion, and as generally established by film critics). That was not a matter of not wanting to hear someone else's different (but interesting) opinion, more like skipping posts by a guy who's too much in love with his own voice. Which is also visible here.
faetal on 12/6/2020 at 08:21
Quote Posted by Sulphur
I'm saying you're incredibly wrong, though, and I doubt I'm alone in that.
Late to the party, but +1 here too.
EDIT: Just to point out a pretty basical logical error:
"We call
X people
Y, but that's not racist, because
Y is just a descriptor."
No, X is the descriptor. Have a decent think about what the actual purpose of Y is. Why it was used at all, given the existence of X.
Mr.Duck on 12/6/2020 at 08:38
Quote Posted by icemann
And sure if that makes me a racist that's fine really. Never said I wasn't.
I appreciate all of you in letting me know that my style of posting and opinions is not welcome here. Consider me gone from the forums. I'm done posting in it. Goodbye.
Inline Image:
https://media.giphy.com/media/bkiBOCL34XzYA/giphy.gifPS. Gene Wilder deserves better than you using him as your final sign-off from TTLG.
PSS. +1 to Sulph. <3
Gryzemuis on 12/6/2020 at 08:42
I like this song.
[video=youtube;QreMs2glyYM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QreMs2glyYM[/video]
Jeshibu on 12/6/2020 at 10:53
Quote Posted by icemann
Go fuck yourself loser. Hope you get hit by a car.
Hey man you sound upset. Are you sure a forum that makes you upset is right for you?
Jeshibu on 12/6/2020 at 11:23
Quote Posted by icemann
I'm over it. All good. Thought I was more appreciated. Now I know. Words were said that had to be said.
Good, knowing is half the battle. I hope you stop and think about why this is, though.
Quote Posted by icemann
And those that chose to kick a person when they were down will be remembered.
[video=youtube;u5k_arVcqR8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5k_arVcqR8[/video]
PigLick on 12/6/2020 at 12:01
icemann chill dude, i think you are ok, but you really need to avoid these kind of threads and stick to gen gaming. Sometimes there are people who are smarter and more erudite than yourself( and I include MYSELF in that), you just have to accept that.
And the whole thing about the term wog is totally wrong. It came from an incredibly racist white australia in the 50's and 60's when a lot of greek and italians immigrated to australia after the war because we needed the workforce. Its exactly like the term nigger, black americans co-opted it as a reaction against the hateful origins of the term, just as comedians here did with wog. I dont know anyone that would use the term in casual conversation unless they meant it in a racist fashion i.e "those bloody wogs next door are having a loud party again!"
I used to play in a band with a filipino singer, and she would regularly get the "you love me long time!" thrown at her at gigs, and this was in the late 90's early 2000's. Bullshit, and for you not to realize that this is an issue isnt a great look for you, you come across as kinda dumb, sorry.
Jeshibu on 12/6/2020 at 12:10
Quote Posted by icemann
lol
I didn't see you telling Duck off for his underhanded comment.
Anyways was some high levels of toxicity in this thread so I've got nothing else to say here.
That's because I thought you deserved it. You seem to enter discussions convinced of your right, and nothing will dissuade you. You make up justifications for your positions rather than basing your positions on actual thought. Nobody can get through to you, and believe me we've tried.
How many debates do you feel you've lost? I bet you think it's 0.
How many times have you changed your mind because of something someone said to you personally? People are supposed to converse and sharpen/adjust their ideas based on solid arguments from others, not try to barrel through the opposition with whatever you can come up with. You're not supposed to be your own inviolate fortress of ideas that can never change.
Please, listen to people when they talk to you.
qolelis on 12/6/2020 at 14:24
I have long been a believer of "words just being words". It's rather the intent and the context in which they are being used that is the problem, not the words themselves. At the same time, the same thing has been said about guns and I don't like those, so, yeah, double standards.
I guess what I have long failed to understand is that, outside academic use, there are contexts, other than the current, so bad that the use of certain words can actually cause not just offense, but someone being scared for their life, because of historical or self-experienced violent connotations, even if the current context is benign. To me, it seems unnecessary to be the cause of that.
At the same time, to be afraid of words in each and every context also seems unnecessary. I could tell someone to "just be rational about it" -- and also have in the past. This might just be me failing to understand that other people are more emotional than I am, though, and that they might not be able to rationalize their fears -- even when trying to.
Now, I don't go around using these words anyway, because I have no reason to. That, in itself, doesn't make me a better person, though. Maybe not having a reason is the only reason. Maybe I only do it out of self-preservation and not because I really care. It's not up to me to judge my own character.
I think my "words just being words" stance comes partly from being used to being objective and analytical, partly from a history of dissociation as a way of coping, and partly from growing up in a bit of a sheltered community (not gated, but sheltered). Lately, like in the last ten years or so, I have come to realize I, too, have, and have had, contexts, even benign ones, in which I feel threatened, because of a certain cultural norm of that context, and maybe I can use that to better understand others.
So, what I'm trying to say is that I think I understand what icemann is saying, but also what Sulphur is saying. Yeah, I'm one of those people, looking at everything from all sides. That's probably why I've never been much of an activist, because that requires going to extremes. At the same time, in part I do have activists to thank for being able to be myself more than maybe I could have otherwise.
Sulphur on 12/6/2020 at 14:34
icemann: I think Jesh made the most productive post out of all of this. I'm going to call out a couple of things because I think a lot of what just happened is not okay and we can't just simply move on without addressing it:
1.) You think that what Thirith said was harsh - maybe it is, I personally don't think so - but that doesn't make it untrue. You think what Duck did was uncalled for - that also doesn't make it untrue. The reaction to both of them was out of line and, frankly, immature.
2.) Apologising for your stance on 'wog' is all well and good, but please understand that this does not address the core issue, which is an entirely more problematic thing: being unaware of why defending a term like this puts you squarely on the bigot side of social interaction.
I can understand having deep ties to this place and suddenly seeing your relationship with it turned on its head, but these observations you took so badly to didn't develop overnight. People have been talking about this for a while, it takes being able to listen. I want to be sympathetic, but I don't think this is the time or the place to coddle anyone. We owe it to ourselves to be better.
