Ruins of Originia FM1: Mines of Margroth (Oct. 27/2002) support - by YcatX
baeuchlein on 8/8/2020 at 12:36
So, let's see whether I got this right... You create a very specific situation (new_mantle disabled, guards unconscious), then use a certain bug twice in connection with doors and moss arrows... and then you suddenly discover that using two bugs to your advantage created a third bug, and now you want that to be fixed?:wot:
And I thought I had weird hobbies.:rolleyes:
Xmodule999 on 8/8/2020 at 13:19
With new_mantle also possible to replicate this bug. Because of two locations in this mission where is possible to get under ground (first is brush with text Only when both eyes see fire, will the inner temple doors be opened - only T2 version, second is well near text Well of lost souls).
fortuni on 8/8/2020 at 13:33
I've never heard of the the GentleClip bug, but apart from that the rest of the ‘bug' report makes no sense anyway. ‘Going underground (first is brush with text only....)
Of course there's a bug, you've broken the mission by the sound of it.
If your going to report a bug in future we need specific details as to precisely what's wrong and where, posting saves, screenshots, Dromed info such as obj no's, Dromed links etc.
Your report is far to generalised, giving no information that we can use.
I also extensively bug tested this mission a couple of years ago and was happy everything is good.
No further action required.
tone_lord on 17/8/2020 at 02:37
Well. Somehow I missed this one in all the years since it came out.
And I'm glad I did.
So far, it is the most obtuse, annoying, purposeless mission I have ever played.
So. Now I see no choice but to read the whole mission thread in detail from beginning to end, with spoilers, to try to decide if I even want to proceed. One frustration after another, with no sense of direction, plot, or purpose in what I have done.
Apparently, I'm missing something.:mad:
baeuchlein on 17/8/2020 at 14:14
Quote Posted by tone_lord
So far, it is the most obtuse, annoying, purposeless mission I have ever played.
[...]One frustration after another, with no sense of direction, plot, or purpose in what I have done.
That is, unfortunately, a constant problem in the first mission of the "Ruins of Originia" campaign, regardless of whether you play the version of the mission included in the campaign (for Thief 2), or the single mission for Thief 1. I do not know whether the mission briefing said it clearly or not - the plot is that you want to steal an old book, most likely in the possession of an Ex-Hammerite priest called Bantar. Bantar went into the Mines of Margroth, and you plan to follow him - or rather search for him once you reach the mines, since he didn't leave any message telling where he went.
In the mission, you should reach the mines early on, but unfortunately, the mines are deep, and quite large. And of course, there are several areas where hostile creatures roam about. Whether you should kill them or rather circumvent them is up to you - I would recommend to save often, and look for strategies to kill the beasts.
Explore the mines and try to find out where new and unexplored areas are. Sometimes, you have to deal with obscure hints on how to proceed from one area to another, e.g., in an underground graveyard. Try to find and read as much readables as you can, for several of them contain hints.
Save before engaging unknown enemies in combat, before doing rather uncommon things (e.g., shooting arrows at some unknown object), and before you possibly lose some equipment (e.g., before shooting a rope arrow to somewhere where you might not be able to retreive it). Be aware that there are various traps or trap-like situations - another reason for saving every now and then.
The following missions in the Thief 2 campaign "Ruins of Originia" are a bit less confusing; you will often not know where to go now, but you usually will see where you have not been yet and should most likely go to. However, it's definitively a good idea to download the campaign's walkthru, since most players use it quite a lot on their first playthrough of these missions.
Keep in mind, though, that the "Mines of Margroth" single mission differs from the campaign version in some regard, especially near the end. If the walkthru tells you to do something you can't, seek guidance in the forums again (and mention which version of this mission you are playing).
Good luck! Whether you will like these missions in the end or not, I cannot say.
klatremus on 22/8/2020 at 20:42
I really don't understand what you mean with no plot, tone_lord. The video briefing and objectives alone are very clear in my mind. The map is also quite detailed in the opening area. This is one of my favorite missions of all time, although I haven't played the rest of the campaign.
"The most obtuse, annoying, purposeless mission I have ever played". With no specifics on what exactly annoys you, what is obtuse, what is purposeless... Sounds like user error to me.
Samantha1 on 20/4/2022 at 15:46
Quote Posted by tone_lord
Well. Somehow I missed this one in all the years since it came out.
And I'm glad I did.
So far, it is the most obtuse, annoying, purposeless mission I have ever played.
So. Now I see no choice but to read the whole mission thread in detail from beginning to end, with spoilers, to try to decide if I even want to proceed. One frustration after another, with no sense of direction, plot, or purpose in what I have done.
I can only agree with this. i dont think I have ever played any mission worse than this and so far (especially lately) I´ve played alot of missions. My annoying barometer rose and rose by minute :laff:
What was the most annoying was the AI. Being one minute in the mission without even being seen or touching anything the gold guards would run around and scream "hey watch out, a thief!!" or stuff like that so that every other person there attacks me aswell. I couldn´t even steal some shabby coins from the bar cause the guy behind it would immediately rise attention to me aswell.
Here I have to mention that I played the T1 mission (though I dont plan on even trying the T2 one after reading baeuchleins comment). It is a mission from 2001 so credit were credit goes, but even from 1999 there are missions far better than this in my opinion. In short: This was so not my cup of tea and I will never ever go back to this one.
baeuchlein on 20/4/2022 at 18:40
Quote Posted by Samantha1
What was the most annoying was the AI. Being one minute in the mission without even being seen or touching anything the gold guards would run around and scream "hey watch out, a thief!!" or stuff like that so that every other person there attacks me aswell. I couldn´t even steal some shabby coins from the bar cause the guy behind it would immediately rise attention to me aswell.
Samantha, I think you had about the worst start into the mission that you could possibly have. There is a point in the mission where lots of hostilities in the starting area suddenly occur, and the player is caught more or less in the middle of it (without "deserving" it, and without too much logic as well). A notable number of killers appear and start killing everyone who sticks his/her nose out. The guards are then on the lookout for anyone somehow looking suspicious, and for no apparent reason, Garrett is such a suspect. As far as I remember, many things one can do in the bar do trigger this.
Exploring the side passage in the large main room of the mine, opposite the door where you can go to the bar and some other "houses", should not trigger those hostilities. Most likely, snooping around in the Hammer area may get you in trouble with the red-clad fanatics, but I don't think the guards outside do notice that. But if I'm not mistaken, the player has to trigger this unfortunate event to proceed at some point of the mission, and the best strategy might be to look for a good hiding place before triggering the fights, then hide there once the fights occur, and wait until at least one group of opponents has bitten the dust. Then it's time to come out and sneak around doing everything needed to leave the mining town area and enter the mines. The pace should slow down notably for a while after reaching the mines.
Whether one wants to do this or not is one's own decision.
Azaran on 20/4/2022 at 20:43
Hey, how dare you taffers malign my favourite campaign??? :mad: :p
So the first mission, I like to go up to the thieves' area to trigger their attack. The thieves and guards end up killing each other while I hide and watch the show. I then knockout the rest.
I also enjoy provoking the bugbeast woman in the mine entrance, luring her to the main area, and let her have a go at the guards.
I'll admit, it's a chaotic mission, but I love it, it's immersive, and eventually you forget the parts that don't make as much sense. It's so surreal, I love it. It's my favourite mission in the campaign
downwinder on 20/4/2022 at 21:14
i love this mission series,i feel you have to be very skilled in thief fan missions to enjoy this series