Fallen+Keeper on 24/4/2005 at 12:08
Got it. So in few words, is there any real possibility that the changes on Enforcers can be made also for those who don't have the editor?
Crispy on 24/4/2005 at 12:43
As far as I understand it (not that I'm an authority on the subject at all :)), those without the editor could still view the changes, but the problem is that the level files need changing. And the level files are huge, so it's not really practical to upload them.
I imagine you could use a binary file patching utility of some sort to only distribute the changed data in the levels, though, which would be much smaller. Depends how much trouble you want to go through. *shrug*
Personally I was really freaked out by the assassins when I played (MY GOD those voices are awesome)... but I do agree that the mass slaughtering was quite ridiculous. The guards ended up taking out half the assassins for me, and then getting killed by the remaining ones; making it much easier for me to sneak across the map. :tsktsk:
Maximius on 24/4/2005 at 14:45
When I saw the first Assassin, I thought TDS had merged with Deep Space 9. All they were missing were communicators and tri-corders, they already had the phaser pistols. Set phasers on Consolisation!
They need to be toned down a LOT in my book. Heres my wishlist
1. No pistols, unless its a CROSSBOW pistol, which is cool. Just swords, arrows, spells, maybe a throwing dagger or something new but no Flash Gordon crap.
2. Equilibriums Assassins were perfect, too damn perfect on expert, I think they should set the standard for abilities vis a vis Garrett. As for other AIs, I think the assassins should be mostly invisible, as Nomad of Pacific has discussed. AIs know something is up, maybe THEY start hunting too, never finding the Assassins but maybe finding you know who. Double trouble for Garrett. I also like the idea of the assassins all knowing his location when one does.
3. The telepathy was a weak powerup for Garrett. It wastn woven into the story line, it just appeared like a bolt from the blue. How about this, Garrett cannot receive Assassin telepathic messages clearly but he can get a little static, a faint buzz in his head. This is maybe his ONLY alert that they are on the prowl. Imagine an FM, you are crawling along a dark castle hallway, spooky as all get out, then suddenly you hear a faint crackle and the hollow, far off buzz of the assassins. Your heart rate will triple, you know now you are being hunted, you will hear faint sounds as they close in, DO SOMETHING!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
:)
Fallen+Keeper on 24/4/2005 at 14:53
Their weapons are ok. They're half-magical beings so making them use crossbows is a little downgrade. We don't need to downgrade them.
Maximius on 24/4/2005 at 16:07
Yes, an Assassins weapon that attracts the attention of everyone for a 100 foot radius. Very sneaky. Maybe a Light Saber as well?
Though come to think of it Fallen Keeper Im not disagreeing about downgrading them. I dont want them any less powerful just not so jarringly futuristic. A crossbow pistol combined with a spell power and a scythe knife for melee, whats wrong with that? Doesnt have to be a crossbow,details aside the point is to make the weapons fit the atmosphere better.
Darsidius on 24/4/2005 at 17:45
Here's a thought. Why not the closer Garret gets to an assasin, the quieter they get in his head? The farther away, the more noise they make. It'll confuse the player, since people are so used to hearing hostile characters shouting louder, the closer they are. Also, it would be nice if they were just invisible, until they stepped in light. Don't know how much of that can be done.
Vivian on 24/4/2005 at 17:58
Quote Posted by Maximius
3. The telepathy was a weak powerup for Garrett. It wastn woven into the story line, it just appeared like a bolt from the blue. How about this, Garrett cannot receive Assassin telepathic messages clearly but he can get a little static, a faint buzz in his head. This is maybe his ONLY alert that they are on the prowl. Imagine an FM, you are crawling along a dark castle hallway, spooky as all get out, then suddenly you hear a faint crackle and the hollow, far off buzz of the assassins. Your heart rate will triple, you know now you are being hunted, you will hear faint sounds as they close in, DO SOMETHING!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
:)
Thats a wicked idea. Can you do custom schemas in T3 yet, though?
Bumbleson on 24/4/2005 at 18:03
After reading through all these wishes, I think we should first try to agree on an exact profile of what modified Enforcers should be like. It's unhelpful when everyone screams for something else and some wishes contradict each other.
From what I know of the editor already, I think some things could be very hard to implement (like all Enforcers becoming aware of Garrett's location when one of them does), so we should first sort out what the majority wants, then the experts can concentrate on the feasible things. How about a little survey?
Fallen+Keeper on 24/4/2005 at 18:26
Good call Bumbleson, but first we need to know if any slight change done to the Enforcers can be proposed as a patch for those without the editor. If it's doable, if it's practical. We can make all wishlist we want until someone skilled pops up to say that it won't be possible without downloading entire set of city levels.
Then we need to figure out how do we want them. :)
But as a thought: there are five points on which everyone will agree I think:
1) The Enforcers should be neutral towards to the other NPCs.
2) The other NPCs should not be aware that they are there. No "Hello!" or "Watch where you're going!".
3) The Enforcers should be less visible to the player. How much is yet to be seen in the actual gameplay.
4) The Enforcers should be more resistant and powerful.
5) They should act as one: if one sees you, everyone knows where you are.
The fifth point is hardly doable you say...
Maximius on 24/4/2005 at 18:51
Agreed, Bumbleson, should we delineate categories for the survey? I propose
1. Physical Appearance of Enforcers: features, uniforms, glowing blue eyes, telepathic signals, etc.
2. Weapons:type, range, combination, and appearance. I think my position on the laser blasters is pretty clear.
3. Enforcer Abilities: invisibility,partial, total, Garrett only or all AIs, maybe some new stuff like a spell power or whatever.
Uncle Bacon: Im too new to editing to do much, sad to say. Im glad you like the idea though, I think it has a lot of spookiness potential. Especially in a REALLY dark scary fm where you think you are alone.......Ooooo or how about this, the thoughts are MOSTLY scrambled and static but occasionally Garrett hears a word or two like "Kill" or "target sighted" or "thief....closeby..." mixed in. Just enough to unerve him. Shoot me a PM if you want to try to figure it out.
Darsidius: I like that idea a lot, but maybe not all the time. What do you think about this: Garrett can hear the faint buzzes of their thoughts approaching,nothing really clear but it serves to warn as a guards footsteps do...
BUT
When the enforcers see or hear Garrett, they go into Defensive mode, scrambling their thoughts so now he cannot tell if they are close or far. He cannot stop listening to them, now they are a plague in his head. One second it seems they are behind him, the next a mile away. Meanwhile they are steadily hunting, hunting, hunting...
Besides not wanting to get caught by the enforcers, a new layer of difficulty is added by just being detected by them. The tables flip, and Garretts advantage becomes a disadvantage. Classic Thief balance of powers.
