june gloom on 24/2/2009 at 14:52
How about no. I don't really care much about the ongoing argument between you and L'il Miss Texas here (it's like you're both trying to show who's shittier at debate), but trying to make the other person sound racist to further your own argument is one of those things that really make you look like a douchebag.
Do yourself everyone else a favour and read her posts while pretending you haven't written her off as a racist. The corruption of officials and savagery of the drug cartels is why Mexico is in shambles, not the other way around. I realize I'm pretty much repeating what she said, but she was spot on for at least that much.
I'm also trying to figure out where exactly she said that the higher crime rate in Mexico was due to Mexicans in general, because I spent 15 minutes looking for it and found nothing to even implicate that.
I'm just calling you on this one issue, I'm not even going to fucking get involved in the rest of this silly bullshit. It's not fucking worth it, not in CommChat.
Volitions Advocate on 24/2/2009 at 15:01
Whatever the argument is, culture definately plays a huge part.
In Canada you can be charged with 2nd degree murder for killing somebody who breaks into your house if there is enough evidence that they didn't intent to kill you first.
(
http://www.self-defender.net/law5.htm)
Ive only heard of this happening once in my lifetime.
Of course in the U.S. if a burglar falls down your stairs because he trips on your kids toy he can sue you... So if somebody does break into your house it's probably smarter to make sure he doesn't leave alive right?
There are all sorts of things orbiting the gun issue that greatly (and directly) influence the violence problem.
Stitch on 24/2/2009 at 15:19
Quote Posted by dethtoll
Holy fucking shit, you just love to twist things around, don't you?
(
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1823894#post1823894) You don't always have to click "Submit Reply," you know.
Edit: For the record, I'd love to hear an intelligent, supported articulation of Old and Cunning's argument (assuming one exists) from someone who isn't otherwise too busy projecting her debating inadequacies on the competition.
Vivian on 24/2/2009 at 15:38
Quote Posted by dethtoll
Righteous indignation
I would say more ignorant than racist, to be honest. If you honestly think that corruption, organised crime or whatever other angels of social destruction can just arise out of the dust and drag a society down into poverty you're either stupid or not thinking it through. Poverty and corruption are intertwined, and although there is some localised, proximate causation of the former by the latter, I would definitely claim poverty as the ultimate cause of corruption - or rather, a more equitably wealthy society is the cure for corruption. By pointing the finger at the drug cartels/whatever rather than at the economic circumstances they operate in, Old and Cunning, to me at least, was literally implying that somehow Mexico's problems were some inherent fault of the Mexicans, whether or not she realised that.
PS I imagine you with a squeaky voice now.
june gloom on 24/2/2009 at 15:47
yes well sometimes I can't help myself
Also Vivian you're one to talk about righteous indignation you chuffing hypocrite.
Vivian on 24/2/2009 at 15:51
I like to think I'm more of the righteous and less of the indignant. Hey, you don't actually have a squeaky voice, do you? I've got the idea stuck in my head now.
..spff, hypocrite? from someone who comes wading in shouting 'douchebag' and then finished with 'but I'm not getting involved'?
june gloom on 24/2/2009 at 15:52
Whatever helps you sleep at night.
fett on 24/2/2009 at 15:55
Quote Posted by Nameless Voice
Situation 1: neither of us have gunsI grab what I can and run away. Maybe I hit the home-owner and do some minor injury to stop them from catching me, but nothing serious.
NV - I have to call bullshit here. The idea of some deadbeat breaking into
MY house, that
I paid for, to steal stuff that
I have purchased with
MY OWN money from work that
I have done is
unacceptable and should be met with
whatever force necessary to prevent it. Not to mention that having my home invaded in such a manner, and suffering even a
minor injury is
NOT ACCEPTABLE. My wife and kids would be traumatized. My 7 year old wouldn't be able to sleep. It would disrupt my entire life. I go into to look at my boys every night before I go to bed and knowing that they feel safe and secure is the most important thing in my life. Also, I would have to replace whatever the intruder had grabbed - my television? My computer? These things cost money -
a lot of money in my case, and they were not easily come by to begin with. Notice all the "me's" and "my's" in there? Maybe it's an American thing but my shit is my shit and you better leave it the fuck alone because it's mine. I am not a socialist, nor do I feel sorry for some junkie waste of oxygen that survives by leaching off other people.
I don't own a gun and I never will. But if I did and I caught someone creeping around my house in the middle of the night, bet your balls I would shoot that fucker dead because
I don't know his intentions. Maybe he'll only steal my i-pod, but maybe he intended to rape my wife and kill my kids. If he doesn't want to get shot, maybe he should stay the fuck out of other people's houses.
That said, I DO own a 150lb. Alaskan Malamute that would do far more damage than a gunshot wound to an intruder. Maybe that's the more dangerous thing because with a gun, at least I can stop shooting. Once she thinks someone is threatening her pack, she wouldn't stop until that person was dead and digested.
My point is that I don't buy into this idea that taking a human life is oh so horrible and wouldn't I rather just surrender and let someone take my stuff than to kill someone. Emphatically, without hesitation, my answer is
NO. If someone breaks into my house or threatens my family in any way, I would kill them 100 times over without shedding a tear.
Stitch on 24/2/2009 at 16:08
Quote Posted by dethtoll
Whatever helps you sleep at night.
You aren't going to win this one, champ.
june gloom on 24/2/2009 at 16:11
Of course not. It's CommChat and I don't march in lockstep with the Approved Opinion.
