T-Smith on 27/9/2005 at 02:43
I recently installed GarrettLoader (currently running V1.12, but I had the same problem I'm about to describe with the previous version). I'm using a clean install of Thief 3 (no Minimalist or custom textures), I downloaded the proper .exe editor file since I don't have the editor installed myself, and I added the required lines to the user.ini. I've downloaded two FMs (Impurities in the Mix and Special Vintage), and tried playing them both, and I have the same problem with both.
When I get to the main title screen, the game runs EXTREMELY SLOWLY. When I actually play the FMs themselves, I occasionally experiance horrible slowdown, and whenever a piece of loot comes into my view, the game damn near stops, the slowdown becomes horrific.
I'm running on 512DDR RAM, Athalon XP 2400, and a RADEON 9200. Now I know you'd automatically assume that the video card is the problem, but the thing is I've always been able to run the primary game (Thief 3) with none of these problems, typically at a decent FPS of around 25, with all the settings turned down.
I was wondering if there was any reason anyone can think of outside of the video card of why this might be happening. I plan to upgrade the card soon, but I wonder why I can run Deadly Shadows just fine, but not these FMs (though I know there's a large difference between the two of them).
DarkDragon on 27/9/2005 at 03:12
has GL added the VertexPools lines to the user.ini? Maybe that could be your problem
ascottk on 27/9/2005 at 03:15
Quote Posted by T-Smith
I've always been able to run the primary game (Thief 3) with none of these problems, typically at a decent FPS of around 25, with all the settings turned down.
The OMs were restricted by xbox limitations while the FMs are not. So if you have "a decent FPS of around 25, with all the settings turned down" (keywords "settings turned down") then FMs will challenge your setup.
Also if the FMs are using custom or hi-res textures you will see them while you're playing. It doesn't matter if you don't have John P's textures or not.
It is known that altering the vertex pools can challenge a pc even though the OMs run fine. Try lowering the vertex pools. Here's a quote from the FM forum:
Quote Posted by GlasWolf
Careful with this - the default PC values are as follows:
DynamicVertexPool0=3145728
StaticVertexPool=2621440
StaticShadowVertexPool=1572864
The values mentioned above (3145728, 3145728 and 2621440 respectively) are the lowest settings I could get Schism to load with - notice the first one hasn't been changed at all.
potterr on 27/9/2005 at 06:57
Like ascottk said, GL sets the vertext pools to a highish level, this will be slightly lower by default for the next release of GL, but due to the fact that most of the FMs are/will be bigger than the originals you may well expect more slowdowns than with the original missions.
However having played a few of the contest missions they run fine without vertext pool changes so should be ok on your system.
Ziemanskye on 27/9/2005 at 09:58
A couple people have posted this - the problem is probably the vertex pools.
I recommended high numbers, but it only slightly degrades perfromance for me (though ironically, the OMs never ran too well). They can be reduced, so try the bracketed numbers GlasWolf suggests, it'll probably help.
DarkDragon on 27/9/2005 at 15:18
What are Vertex pools anyway? :sly:
potterr on 27/9/2005 at 16:45
I think its possibly to do with limitations for the number of polygons/objects that can be viewed/handled at any one time. Although if it is I don't quite understand why it bombs out on loading rather than while playing.
Crispy on 28/9/2005 at 09:25
My best guess is that the vertex pool is an area of memory that Thief 3 allocates for storing information about each vertex in the level (at least from meshes, and probably BSP as well). It loads the entire map into memory at once; "streaming" the map from the hard drive is possible, but very tricky and annoying to program correctly. So when it loads a map, it needs enough space in the vertex pool to store every vertex in the map; otherwise, boom!
Why a "vertex pool"? Well, memory allocation is a slow operation, so you don't want to be allocating memory every time you load a vertex, or you'd be doing it millions of times every time you loaded a map; very inefficient! A "pool" is a large block of memory that's allocated once (on startup) and released once (when the program exits), and is managed internally. That way you avoid allocating memory for each vertex, and the program runs faster.
The ideal setting for the vertex pool is the exact size needed to contain the largest map you'll load during the one session of Thief 3. Any smaller and it crashes; any larger and you're wasting memory that could be better used for storing other data.
potterr on 28/9/2005 at 16:12
Which I would say is why its important for FM makers to make sure their user_patch.ini files are correct for their missions...although it would be difficult to say the best way of working it out though other than trial and error.
keyplayer on 30/9/2005 at 17:37
I have Garrettloader setup adn everything seems to work but after T3 loads and I click to actually start the game T3 just shuts down :(
Any help would be great
