TriangleTooth on 3/9/2013 at 19:23
Ah but also, Garrett was shown at E3 to have a journal where he could view the map that he stole as an object. However, whether this will be practical in any way is yet to be seen.
Springheel on 3/9/2013 at 21:00
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But you've just said you accept it as an abstraction.
Yes, but ZB was arguing it was "entirely realistic, just exaggerated". It's not realistic for tile surfaces to make more noise than grass or dirt, unless you're wearing metal shoes.
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Quote:
Walk on a tile floor in running shoes and tell me how loud it is.
And I doubt Garrett is wearing modern running shoes. Would his shoes even have rubber soles? I doubt it.
If ZB has a pair of soft-soled, medieval leather boots, great, he can try it with them.
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"Footsteps making sound" maps pretty much precisely to real life, in which footsteps make sound.
Thanks Captain Obvious. Who is arguing that footsteps shouldn't make sound?
fett on 3/9/2013 at 22:38
Vivian just won the forum, let's all go home. :thumb:
Chade on 3/9/2013 at 23:04
Quote Posted by Vivian
When crouched your leg is compressed/shortened at midstance and can be much longer at foot-down/up, which results in a much smaller overall rise/fall in your centre of mass over the stride (less potential energy fluctuation in your centre of mass - if you don't shorten your leg at midstance, your centre of mass has to rise). Seeing as the energy fluctuations in your centre of mass are a primary determinant of foot loading and foot impact, crouching is generally quieter. More bendy legs = less uppy-downy = less bangy. It's why cats do it.
Is that still true at the level that you crouch in thief (and most typical computer games)? Off the top of my head, a crouch basically halves your head-level. That's not the sort of stalking motion that cats do ... err, I think* ... that's moving about with your bum centimeters above your ankles. (Ok ok, cats ankles are basically always just below their bum ... but that's different!)
When I see people trying to move quietly, they are bending their legs, but their head level isn't even remotely down as much as when you crouch in a computer game. Maybe they're doing it wrong? But intuitively, it seems to me that at some point the awkwardness of moving so low has to overcome the advantages of bending your legs.
* Because clearly watching the odd animal documentary makes me an
expert.
Vivian on 3/9/2013 at 23:14
In theory, the more crouched you go, the longer strides you can make while minimising the uppy-downy bit. But yeah, you get into problems of leverage pretty quickly - more crouched your leg, worse your mechanical advantage against your own weight is, more it costs you in terms of muscular effort to stand and move, more stress it puts on your skeleton. Creaky knees, stability problems etc. I guess in vidyas it's an attempt to combine a quieter-movement sort of ninja-crouch and an actually crouching-behind-a-box sort of crouch. I mean, it gets used for both those situations, so it has to be low enough for hiding to seem realistic behind stuff it seems like you should be able to hide behind.
Chade on 3/9/2013 at 23:41
So if we assume that your default skulking about posture is already slightly bent, should Garrett actually raise his head level slightly when he starts sprinting and lower it again when he stops?
ZylonBane on 3/9/2013 at 23:45
Quote Posted by Springheel
Yes, but ZB was arguing it was "entirely realistic, just exaggerated". It's not realistic for tile surfaces to make more noise than grass or dirt, unless you're wearing metal shoes.
False. It's realistic for tile (or any rigid surface) to make more noise when wearing
any footwear with a rigid outsole or heel-- metal, hard leather, wood, etc.
Tile floors are also highly acoustically reflective, so any sounds made are going to propagate more before being absorbed.
SubJeff on 4/9/2013 at 00:14
Yep. Running shoes would squeak and if you've ever done this on tiles in a large old house you'll know it's hella noisy.
jtbalogh on 4/9/2013 at 05:58
Rather go in socks than running shoes, slippers, etc. when stealing away to the fridge at night because of the noise over wood and tile. Unfortunately, socks are a big problem on broken glass noise patches :p
SubJeff on 4/9/2013 at 07:30
You ever been outside in just socks? Go shopping in socks, walk on the pavement. Better yet walk on a road or a cobbled street.
