Possibly good news in the Take 5 answers

Chade on 2/9/2013 at 23:38

Well, you know what they say: location, location, location! :p

Seriously, it's not meant to stand up to close scrutiny. He lives in a modest apartment because it wouldn't suit his character to live in luxury. He steals "for retirement" because the writers need time for the real plot to develop. He hasn't retired yet because we still want to play as Garrett. That's all.

Springheel on 3/9/2013 at 00:33

Quote:

a feature which most people who play the Thief games have no problem accepting as an abstraction

Yes, I had no problem accepting it as an abstraction either, just like I had no problem accepting the boxy models and poor graphics as abstractions. But I wouldn't try to argue that they're important to retain in a modern version of the game. There might be alternative ways of creating an "abstraction of the problem of moving stealthily through varied environments" that's just as effective but more realistic.

And you've been around long enough to know how often threads like "A master thief with a pair of boots? absurd!" and "Tap Shoes - An Alternative" get posted.

Quote:

as an abstraction of the problem of moving stealthily through varied environments (an abstraction which is in fact entirely realistic, just exaggerated).

Walk on a tile floor in running shoes and tell me how loud it is.

Robert4222 on 3/9/2013 at 00:57

I make more sound walking on grass and wooden surfaces than on tile surfaces.

SubJeff on 3/9/2013 at 07:29

Quote Posted by Springheel

And you've been around long enough to know how often threads like "A master thief with a pair of boots? absurd!" and "Tap Shoes - An Alternative" get posted.

Who cares what people who haven't thought it thought think?

Quote:

Walk on a tile floor in running shoes and tell me how loud it is.

But you've just said you accept it as an abstraction.

And I doubt Garrett is wearing modern running shoes. Would his shoes even have rubber soles? I doubt it.

Vivian on 3/9/2013 at 08:12

Quote Posted by Robert4222

Not to break the topic but, How the hell does crouching reduce the sound you make?

When crouched your leg is compressed/shortened at midstance and can be much longer at foot-down/up, which results in a much smaller overall rise/fall in your centre of mass over the stride (less potential energy fluctuation in your centre of mass - if you don't shorten your leg at midstance, your centre of mass has to rise). Seeing as the energy fluctuations in your centre of mass are a primary determinant of foot loading and foot impact, crouching is generally quieter. More bendy legs = less uppy-downy = less bangy. It's why cats do it.

Thirith on 3/9/2013 at 08:45

@Vivian, that post makes me wish there was an "Awesome" button on these boards. It's pure gold. :-)

SubJeff on 3/9/2013 at 11:52

Vivian dropping the stealth science itt!! BAM

Shinrazero on 3/9/2013 at 17:48

I don't think it has been mentioned so if it has, my apologies but it looks like subby's contextual jump thread has now been locked and everyone is supposed to ask their questions in the take 5 thread. It was locked so a mod thread can "gain some traction."

ZylonBane on 3/9/2013 at 18:10

Quote Posted by Springheel

There might be alternative ways of creating an "abstraction of the problem of moving stealthily through varied environments" that's just as effective but more realistic.

There aren't. As such things go, this is nothing like something as heavily abstracted as, say, hit points. "Footsteps making sound" maps pretty much precisely to real life, in which footsteps make sound. It has the further benefit of being a symmetrical system-- guards can hear your steps, but you can also hear theirs. Nobody ever complains about guards wearing tap shoes, now do they? It even says something about the realism of the system that when people do criticise it, it's so often in terms of Garrett's choice of footware, placing the blame in-universe rather than on the system itself.

So stop being a loony.

Renault on 3/9/2013 at 18:44

There was a recent podcast, and I didn't want to create a whole new thread for it because it's mostly the same old BS, but I did want to mention that per the devs that were interviewed, the only map that Garrett will have in the new game is his minimap. I'm a little disappointed by that, I love the old maps, and I thought it was great how they were sketched out, very believable that were just "notes from a servant" or "a layout provided by a contact of mine" and so forth. EM is claiming Garrett, as a master thief, has now memorized his maps ahead of time, and the minimap (which can be toggled on/off) is just a representation of info already in Garrett's head. :p

Edit: Also, as an aside, it's going to be interesting to see the results of the "(http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=139184) Movement Mechanics" Q&A with the devs.