Muzman on 14/11/2010 at 09:06

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OK, some seasoning has taken place so I can write a bit more.

I've only tried the dynamic contrast in short bursts. I'm sure it has some uses, but for games where you want your darks pretty well set (ie; they feature night and expect you to have human eyes) it seems to over do it. It may depend in the game as well. A modern iris/hdr utilising game might fare better. For something like Thief1/2 etc it basically means there aren't a lot of dark places left once it gets going. Worth noting that the dynamic contrast isn't just adjusting the contrast, as I generally understand it, but rebalancing the brightness and contrast together. That may be usual, I don't know.
(honestly I haven't quite figure out the whole brightness contrast thing on this monitor. The brightness control generally behaves like a brightness control, but I understand it's controlling the backlight so it kinda brings the whole range up and down too. The contrast control behaves mostly like a contrast control up until the 50 mark. Above that (to 100) it doesn't really alter the contrast. Instead it seems to up the overall power, making highlights much brighter but not touching much else. This strikes me as an odd configuration. I'm not sure though.)
The other main strike against using dynamic contrast is that you can't set it to a given range or anything and so it uses the entire... I dunno, luminance range of the monitor and so is mega bright all the time. Which I find punishing to say the least.
I'm not sure Biker's assesment has the technicals the same as I would but the overall assessment is much the same from me (You can only switch it on in video mode which may be telling us something. I think it's only good for that sort of thing; watching movies or something during daytime ambient light).

Regarding the backlight bleed; it could be that I'm just not used to it. It has become more tollerable with time and tweaking. It's still kinda sad though. Most reviews don't even notice it, it seems. So I'm just an old stick in the mud.

I did a little pic to illustrate. (http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/images/dell_u2711/P1030791.JPG) This picture of the screen in the dark, from (http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/dell_u2711.htm) this review isn't overly out of whack. It's limited somewhat by the camera they're using, I'd say, by the dynamic range and noise. But using that I(http://members.iinet.net.au/~ragtag/u2711thiefpic.jpg) doctored up a pic of Thief on the screen to give the impression of the bleed as illustrated there. It won't work too well on a bright background that shot, and of course the reality isn't noisy like that, but that gives you an idea what I mean. It's not accurate, but it's close (I think centre clarity is better than that indicates and the bleed is more uniform and not as heavy on the top right). This is with brightness at zero and contrast at 100, which seems best for dark games generally. Settings I derived from trying to match the contrast I was getting on the old crt. As I said, the monitor can do it, but is hurt by this backlight bleed. The extent of which I blame on the diffusion layer. Removing it is major surgery that often leaves tiny scratches all over the screen, so I wouldn't even consider it. But, man, foggy corners are annoying at times.

I'll have to try a lamp behind it sometime for a bit of extra help there. On the plus side there is space to do this now.

Lesee, what else: Colour. The ten bit spread is more present than I initially admitted to myself. It helps that I've hooked up the old screen next door and can see quite clearly what is going on. As awkward as it can make things for accurate colour work I've come to rather like it. The colour range makes old sRGB seem very limited and drab and seems a lot closer to the range seen in life. It still manages to 'stretch' sRGB material neatly enough that it mostly has an enhancing effect rather than anything bad. I can't wait until true ten bit systems become the norm.
(http://www.artstorm.net/journal/2009/07/color-management-wide-gamut-dell-2408/) This article goes into a lot a bout how to cope with varying colour work environments quite nicely (and since Photoshop can clamp the gamut so effectively in its own workspace my hack brain can't really figure out why this wouldn't be possible to do for the entire desktop and everything else at all times, with a performance hit perhaps. But I dunno really).
The best way, of course, is to run it on another monitor and check if you're really worried (production types in audio and TV etc have been doing that sort of thing for ages, so I guess PC designers are joining the fold there).

On that subject, I'm looking for some sort of extended desktop program that lets me run both monitors at their individual optimum resolutions and refresh rates and doesn't insist on the task bar being stretched right across and so on (I think my ideal contiguous point would be joining the top right corner of the dell to the top left corner of the viewsonic crt. This may violate some fundamental computer law, I dunno.)

I've found a few interesting looking ones. If anyone has any experience with them or some other, lemee know.

(http://www.realtimesoft.com/ultramon/overview/)
(http://www.ishadow.com/Downloads/EvaluationVirtualDisplayManager/tabid/115/Default.aspx)

redrain85 on 23/1/2011 at 16:53

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I just bought a new monitor, and thought I'd unlurk to share my experience with it.

It's the BenQ EW2420. This monitor probably won't tick every feature box that people will want, but there are two aspects to it that make this monitor a very attractive buy. The VA panel, and the low price.

Pros
+ 24 inch 8-bit A-MVA panel (VA vs. IPS can be argued, but it's definitely better than TN)
+ Price (can be had for ~$250)
+ Semi-gloss coating (reduces reflections while still adding vibrance)
+ Lots of connectivity options and extras (VGA, DVI, HDMI, USB ports, headphone jack, built-in speakers)
+ Extremely deep blacks, and visible detail in dark scenes (3000:1 contrast ratio)
+ Standard color gamut
+ Backlight bleed is minimal
+ Wide viewing angles without much color shift (178 degrees horizontally)

Cons
- 16:9 1920x1080 (only listing this as a negative because I know some people prefer 16:10)
- W-LED backlighting (again, only listing as negative since I know some prefer CCFL lighting)
- Factory color presets are awful, custom settings are a must
- No height adjustment and can only be tilted forward and back
- Slight ghosting evident when bright objects move across dark backgrounds (8ms grey-to-grey response time with AMA turned on)
- OSD controls are a bit awkward to use

If you'd like to read a review of the EW2420, the following site probably has the best overall review of it.

(http://www.pcmonitors.org/monitor-reviews/benq-ew2420)

There's also a video review from someone else.

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s90Hl8LU75Y)


Although I would have preferred a 16:10 monitor again myself, they are getting hard to find at a more reasonable price. You either have to buy them used if you want a better panel, or settle for TN if you buy new. Or wait for some kind of crazy sale on the Dell IPS monitors.

My previous monitor was the Acer 2216W which had a 16:10 22 inch TN panel at 1680x1050. It was a decent bang for the buck monitor at the time, but I wanted a better panel. Before that, I had a Samsung 172T 17 inch IPS monitor. The difference between the two was night and day.

I haven't gotten around to playing any of the Thief titles or SS2 yet, but I have tried Amnesia: The Dark Descent and Penumbra: Overture since they have similar atmosphere to the LG/Irrational games. They look fantastic, I must say. The detail you can see in the darkness is incredible, versus my old Acer.

However. Before I finish: I have to mention one caveat about this monitor. Early on in the production run, BenQ had some serious quality control issues. Early units had bad backlight uniformity, as well as bleed. There was also something known as a "ripple effect" along the bottom of the screen whenever you displayed a bright solid shade. The monitor is lit from the bottom by a row of LEDs, and there's a diffuser that spreads out the light across the back of the panel. The "ripple" was the LEDs being reflected against the front of the panel and becoming visible as dark shadows.

I actually received one of these early units, at first. Not only did it have the ripple, but it also had a dead pixel. The manufacture date of the monitor was September 2010, so it was an early one. The retailer I bought it from has a form of insurance you can buy to protect you against defects (some of you may know of NCIX), so I returned it and had another one shipped. Fortunately, the second one I now own has a later November 2010 manufacture date and is perfect.

If you manage to get an EW2420 from later in the production run: you should be set, and generally pleased with what you get for the low price. But if possible, you should buy from a place like NCIX where you can purchase extra protection against defects, just in case you still get an early unit. (Not all the early ones were defective, though.)

jay pettitt on 27/1/2012 at 15:49

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Thief is interesting because more often than not it chucks out visuals that have very little contrast - so you want a screen that can reproduce those kind of scenes quite sensitively.

I really don't know about either of those particular screens I'm afraid, but the ones I've had trouble with are cheap ones where contrast is lost very quickly when you're not at exactly the right viewing angle. That just makes playing Thief miserable.

Of the two, the Dell is boasting a slightly wider viewing angle - but really not by much. If you can find one in the shops to look at it'd help - if contrast changes noticeably if you move your head a little amount then walk away.

Reflections can make low contrast scenes difficult to see too, so I'd be inclined to skip super glossy coatings.

Also it might be good on tellies, but DEATH to wide angle computer screens :mad::mad::mad:

jay pettitt on 27/1/2012 at 19:06

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Yeah sorry, I meant death to wide screens

Just imagine how roomy those interfaces would be if they also had room for a top and a bottom.

Renzatic on 27/1/2012 at 19:49

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We're about to have an argument, aren't we? :mad: