Flux on 20/6/2008 at 14:53

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I'm totally lost especially when you say "And especially with multiple levels (like in a building, as I said before), I doubt that it would work if all patrol points were on the same very low (standard) level."

You don't place patrol points on top window, just in perspective window. Actually don't place any actors on top window, just use the perspective window.

Let me go for simple way. Maybe I'm already explaining what you already know, but it might be useful to newcomers in the long run, you know for archive purposes.

You have one street. One house in it. In the house there are two stories. One guard in the street, one guard in the first floor of the house, another one in the second floor of the house. You want these three guards perform a simple patrol.

Right click on street floor. Add two patrol points, connect them. Right click on the floor in the house, add two patrol points, connect them. Right click on the second floor of the house, add two patrol points, connect them. It's that simple, without any regards to altitudes. These three pairs of patrol points, the one in the street, the one in the house on the first floor and the one in the house in the second floor, are not related to each other at all.

Once the ai pathwork is built, turn on those green lines.(nav mesh links) Your ai will go around those green lines, to search and chase the player. They don't need patrol points to search for player. Of course, with different levels of z-axis, there will be different patrol points, up or down. My only point is once you place two patrol points for one ai, you don't have to raise or lower them.

Patrol points are "independent" of these green lines, they simply tell the ai where to patrol. For instance, two patrol points that belong to one pagan is not related to three patrol points belonging to a hammer in the same area who might be walking way above the pagan. That's why we add "addaipoint" to indicate ownership of a patrol point. The yellow line running from an ai to addaipoint indicates that.

Regarding the picture I posted, add surfaces to nav mesh didn't work. And it won't effect the performance since the invisible brush doesn't have any texture. Tds ai is always happier when they walk on bsp, rather than static meshes. Besides this method is way more easier than trying to wrap a nav mesh volume around a rock-shaped static mesh.

Flux on 21/6/2008 at 00:23

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Two guards are sharing the same set of patrol points? If you mean two guards are linked to same set of patrol points, then it's wrong. Each guard should have their own addaipoint and their own set of patrol points.

Also don't copy paste, anything...Only for smeshes, I'd say it's totally safe. Copy-paste actors at your own risk.



It's not my method, it's the only method.:p Trust me on this. I can go on and on why you should never add actors in top or side views but only in perspective window, I'm just tired for now.;) This is unreal engine, you don't do that, it's asking for trouble.

<General comment:
One of the biggest problems of t3ed community other than the "usual suspects" trying to stop people making missions is/was that people quickly embraced the urban legend of "this is not unreal engine, oh so it's so different" attitude when the editor was released in 2004. No, no matter how bastardized, it's still the unreal engine. I'm pretty sure most attempts by first-time t3ed mappers could have been aided by simply reading unreal editor tutorials first. But, as I said above, because of the "this is different than unreal engine" attitude, people didn't./>

Let me sum up;

1) Add a guard, right next to him addai point. See the yellow line running from him to addai point.
2) Right next to addai point, place one patrol point.
3)Then move further whichever direction you want, add another patrol point. Connect two patrol points. See the green arrows(both cyan and green arrows, cyan colored arrow is the actual route he will take). Do not raise or lower patrol points.

It's that simple, repeat these steps for different guards whether they are in the same area or upper parts or lower parts of your level.

Then add one look points or one anim points for each patrol points. If it still freezes, I'd be really curious what's going on there, send me your unr, I really want to take a look.:)

Flux on 21/6/2008 at 09:51

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Just place one guard behind the other one, arrange their set of patrol points so that it would appear as if one is following the other. I don't think you'll need any scripts for that, even if there is any. I can send you a simple room unr with that if you want.;)

Ziemanskye on 21/6/2008 at 13:09

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There is absolutely nothing wrong with having two guys on one set of patrol points.

Seriously, just so long as they have their own AddAIPoint markers to actually attach them to the route.

I will note however that I tend to clone the PatrolPoints *before* I link the points together - with this engine, something that simple could be why things are getting messed up for you (because it's not Unreal - mostly to the effect of being a lot less stable :(). But Schism/Impurities only had around 25 patrol points and everyone was linked to the same circuit. Same thing with the two guys who burst through the door at the start of Townhouse.

I don't know how to force two guys to follow one another apart from putting them on the same route though. There are extra markers for Flock/Patrol-groups or whatever they're called (it's been a while since I looked) but I couldn't work out how to make them work. You can get them to follow the player with a console command, so the behaviour is there, but I don't know how to set it up for between two NPCs.

I'd probably just add an extra (one-way) link in the patrol route for the second guy and put a slight delay on it so he's always a few steps behind, and make the rest of the patrol not have any look/anim points because of how that would cause them to fall further away from each other. Simplest solution, and you can have more NPCs to do the looking and the other actions.

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You can clone (Ctrl+W) most things without problems. NPCs are about the only thing I don't clone, and that's because it tends to forgot to give the clones eyes/teeth/weapons. BSP brushes, smeshes, patrol points, particle emmiters, volumes.... You know, pretty much everything else, I clone like crazy. I've cloned entire rooms - brushes, actors, volumes, lights, the lot, without incident. (Though, I don't use Copy/Paste as such unless I'm doing it from one map to another)

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As for the difficulty thing, yes, in terms of script actions, it's possible - I think it's just a GlobalInt value you check (0 = easy, 1= normal, 2=Hard/expert). There is a script that does that for the OMs to reduce the number of NPCs around, which however it's phrased ammounts to

"If the difficutly is this - remove the stuff at the end of these links"

(check the default scripts on the DifficultyInfo actors, I think that might be how I found out about it, but I'm not sure)

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Oh, and random thing, but the Unreal shortcuts still work too - hold "A" and click in the perspective view to place an instance of whatever Actor you've got selected wherever you click, "L" to place a default light. It might not be that much quicker than right-click menu selections, but it is more impressive looking if someone is watching you work :p

Beleg Cúthalion on 21/6/2008 at 20:21

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@Ziemanskye: No, the markers weren't linked to each other when I copied them. I pride myself on already having some sense of what I shouldn't do with editors. :D I'll just make one guard per patrol for now and hope to get any solution soon.

@havoc211: I've just tried to do the same (especially because I read that one could turn a SMesh into an actor by dropping Key0 and Key1 mover points or something at the start and end position), I added all the properties I found in the secret door actor but to no success. So everything I can do is say hello and welcome to the forums. :) Oh, and the experts will be around here soon.