Renzatic on 14/10/2013 at 22:31
Quote Posted by jay pettitt
Rambo-ing through the levels lets you steal all the loot, right.
Maybe a nice feature would be if the prices available to you depended on how you played.
Potentially. It doesn't account for all the hidden items, which you're more likely to miss if you're just rushing through to beat the game.
Though the idea of using the prices of goods to counterbalance powergamers is an excellent idea. The way I'd like to see it set up is that the more you're seen, the less likely a fence is willing to give you full price for what you steal. After all, if Garrett is spotted at a certain location, and the items the fence is selling are known to come from this certain place, then the risk of association is much greater for the fence, which means he won't be able to sell his stolen goods along his usual channels. He'll have to lower his price to offset the greater risk.
Goldmoon Dawn on 14/10/2013 at 22:56
Imagine if in the midst of their Mission design, there is a series of contextual jumps and even a few contextual rope arrow hot points, that all lead to some obscure area, but when you get there, you find no treasure or anything of any value. Would this enhance your sense of exploration in the game?
ZylonBane on 14/10/2013 at 23:13
Quote Posted by Chade
But XP actively rewarded stealth.
Uh, no. XP actively rewarded headshots.
Chade on 14/10/2013 at 23:33
This is very simple. The XP you get for different outcomes was ranked accordingly:
1) Stealth
2) Headshots
3) Other violent approaches
Presumably we could have split stealth up into more categories and ranked them as well, if we knew more about the system.
The system rewards stealth. Your claim that it rewards headshots is either wrong (if compared to stealth) or irrelevant (if compared to other violent approaches).
SubJeff on 14/10/2013 at 23:45
It doesn't matter which gets more xp, any xp is a reward for action x and that action shouldn't be headshots.
Chade on 14/10/2013 at 23:55
Yes and no. You are generally expected to get a certain amount of XP as you continue playing, or you'll start to fall behind. Anything below that line is not a reward in the long run. Are headshots above or below that line? We'll never know, of course. I imagine it would be slightly above the line, but that's just wild speculation really.
Headshots also have the advantage that they're easier to pull off as a stealthy takedown, rather then when the enemy has spotted you and is moving faster, so I imagine they would encourage sniping over straight combat, which I think is appropriate.
This is all somewhat irrelevant to my original statement, which is just that XP encourages stealth over other approaches.
SubJeff on 15/10/2013 at 01:25
A. You don't know that xp encourages stealth without knowing exactly when and where it will be given in relation to the number of headshots you can get.
B. You're abstracting things to the nth degree to prove a point again. And failing.
jay pettitt on 15/10/2013 at 02:19
Oh. Was Thief 1 & 2 wrong to heap rewards of satisfaction and progress on to the player for making a silent kill with a broad head sent from the shadows? Were Looking Glass Studios staffed by incompetents who didn't 'get' Thief?
LoucMachine on 15/10/2013 at 02:32
If my memory is right, in T1-2 when you shot a ''1 shot kill'' with an arrow the guard started to scream while dying and died from a very tragic manner. soon you would see 2-5 guards arrive and start searching for you.
Goldmoon Dawn on 15/10/2013 at 02:37
Thief: the Dark Project was a real world physics simulator, and as such playing with the bow and arrows was fun, because of the arrows arc through the air when fired. You had to aim high, for shots at greater distances, for example. You discovered on your own through taking the time to experiment or simply being violent, that an unaware guard could be slain with a single arrow. It was personal entertainment and nothing more to see if you could aim high and get a body/headshot all the way across some big gap.
Adding floating xp reminders places unwanted attention on combat. While enthralled with the tense atmosphere playing Dark Project, putting out torches at impossible seeming distances was one of the funnest things Ive ever experienced in any game. Deadly Shadow decimated the arc of the arrow, making it more like a shooting star laser, and from what Ive seen of this new abomination, the arc is even further removed from the pure and enjoyable archery physics simulator that Dark Project offered.
If you take a lot of the attention away from combat, like they tried to do with the "no more xp" announcements, suddenly any remaining stealth elements should come to light, get some of the spotlight. It would be interesting to find out more about why stealth is so awesome in this game vs all the competition. It almost seems as if the Light Gem (light/shadow) and carpet/tile were reduced to "nods".
Please dont tell me that the focus lockpicks are the pinnacle of their crowning achievements of their years in the making stealth game design. I mean, these people *had* the Light Gem, they *had* Stephen Russell, they had the tight sound propagation system, and they choked the life out of them, instead diverting their design resources into overbloated combat options, "rail-form exploration", and illustrious cinematics while greedily planning for a big payoff.
:ebil:
