Queue on 13/1/2009 at 14:46
*kicking at a few loose pebbles*
denisv on 13/1/2009 at 15:08
A narrative extolling bumhood and a morbid ending. That does characterize TTLG.
Kolya on 13/1/2009 at 16:26
Queue, while I agree with your points generally, you probably can see that some of 37637598's remarks are obviously made in a defeatist way, pre-emptying criticism, successful or not.
Also I think that even people who can't write and have no desire to become a good writer can have an idea or be inspiring to others who might see the potential and flesh it all out, kind of like a muse to a writer.
Finally you're criticism is normative, not constructive. The world has forever been flooded by bad poetry and stories. And never did it keep anyone from finding what they think is good. If a few million Betty Sues and Susies love their naive love poems, you have no right whatsoever to say, this ain't poetry, it shouldn't be read and replicated. (Hello book burning?)
In the end this text doesn't hurt you in any way, if you don't like it, just ignore it. I'm sure there's a good book lying half-read in your bed right now, just waiting to be picked up again.
37637598 on 13/1/2009 at 23:32
Quote Posted by Queue
At what time did I ever point out a spelling error? I'm appalled by the content, and the idea.
That was general sarcasm pointed out to everyone... hehehe, I make plenty of spelling and 'punctuation' errors.
Quote Posted by Queue
I don't mean to be a prick here, and don't take this too personally, but you are what is destroying the idea of literature. And by saying "you", it's not "you" as a physical-being. I'm making an analogy toward the attitude
While I see your point, which would similarly frustrate me in the music industry, I'm not trying to write a book. I'm simply trying to make a short film. I realize it's all very amateur, but I just want to make a film. I don't care what the story is, as long as it's within my budget. If I didn't get the response on this story that I have, I wouldn't even consider persuing it anymore. The fact is; People seem to like it, So we'll see where it goes i guess.
Quote Posted by Queue
This statement leads me to question: why? What are you doing then?... Writing is the ultimate form of expression in that it is a direct connection to the writer's inner thoughts. Writing happens when one poises a question and tries to, through story, find an answer. It is the by-product of the writer's thought process and imagination, thus yeilding some sort of truth in the end.
When I say I'm not trying to be a 'writer', I mean I have no desire to go learn writing format, study others work extensively, chew on erasers in hopes of that answer coming, BUT, that doesn't mean I didn't 'think' about how this story would go. Here's my thought process for this movie: A girl who is very lovable, going through a tough time, attempts suicide. A guy going through a much tougher time, enjoys every second of life, every inch of the earth, and he loves the girl. They fall in love, then at the end, I take it all away by saying 'haha, she really died'. That's it, in (very) short. That was my initial idea. Then, I sat down and began thinking, why does she committ suicide. She comes from a loving family gone rotten, broken. She comes from a background of everything good gone bad. This is a reflection of my own past, so of course it fits in my mind. I then had to figure out such things as, why do they fall in love, why does she like him if nothing else in life, why does he finally decide to persue her, how does the viewer grasp this story. I'm certain you're not all seeing the story as I do, and much is lost in translation. I get ideas, I write them down. There are countless box office hits which had no backbone, horrible stories, yet so many people took liking to them, or could relate, which made it a good movie. I'm not trying to be a writer. I'm just trying to create something people can watch, and understand. Perhaps relate in some cases.
Quote Posted by Queue
Yet, you admit freely that you have no desire to improve, no desire to make something better (you'll leave that up to other people), thus excluding you from ever contributing something of value in the grander sense of literature...
I love you for this because it's true and we both know it. I'm not a writer. I'm not a screenplay writer. I'm an audio engineer, a visualizer, and when I work on movies, I write the music. As I've said, the person who normally writes for us (a group of people I work with on small projects) is going to go over this story, fix it, turn it into a real screenplay, and then we will begin actually doing anything with it. The 'Screenplay' I wrote is more of a cluster of ideas, specifics, general ideas of what they might say, or something along the lines. Honestly I don't have time to learn how to use Celtx at the moment, but after having played around with it, I may learn it in the future. I simply wanted to write the story in a format which someone who is actually good at that stuff, can read and work with.
Quote Posted by Queue
Now here is what happens when one does this, it perpetuates bad writing (giving us novels/films like Twilight)...
You're going to hate me for this... People like Twilight. Not always because they think they can write it, but because it paints a picture which they want to be in. I'm trying to do the exact opposite, to a degree. I want people to see this, think "Hey, I want to be her, or him", then when the ending comes, "shit, nevermind". I'm not trying to be the writer, nor do I think there's any place for me as a writer. I think the idea is one which can be worked with. You're telling me I'm not a writer, asking me why I'm not trying to be one, then telling me I'm trying to be a writer and ruining the market for real writers like yourself. I'm not. That's why I'm leaving it up to a real writer to look over this 'idea' and make it worth the time and effort to turn it into a motion picture.
Quote Posted by Queue
I don't know about you, but I worry about that.
I absolutely see your point, and I DO worry about that. I understand that too many people do things they shouldn't even attempt, and they really have no desire to try, they just want the golden ticket. you have to know that I see the same thing every day when it comes to music. Shit lyrics, shit music, shit attitudes, shit in general. Now, if they wrote some shit music that others said have potential, and left it to someone more qualified to shape the music and turn it into something 'good', then I would have no problem. I want you to know that I'm not trying to become a writer, I don't want to be known as a writer and I know that I suck at writing. In the credits for this film, the writer will not be me. It will be my writer. I want every produced film to be a good one. I feel I can contribute my music to help that happen, but with no story to write a film to, theres no film to write music to.
Quote Posted by Queue
I have to call you out on "punctuational", though. That's not even a word!
Haha sorry, I must have meant my (
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/punctuational) punctuationalism? ;]
37637598 on 13/1/2009 at 23:37
Thanks BR, you might notice that I was the 3rd post in that forum. That was back when I was still a radio bitch.
Queue on 14/1/2009 at 13:41
Okay, so now I'm Kolya's bitch as I totally agree with what he said. :erg:
37637598-- don't get me wrong, I'm not hating on you. I'm hating on people that treat the writing process with irreverence--I wish they'd take it more seriously. Personally, I thought the idea was pretty decent, but it needs some fleshing out to fill in the potential story holes (and I understand, that's not what you want your part to be).
Like I said, it's not you, nor your story, it's the process. Too many people are rushing to get their "art" out there without ever once asking themselves, "Is this good?" Or, more importantly, is the work ready to be presented. So many young "writers" today feel that all they need to do is come up the a good idea, throw a few coherent words on paper, and wait for someone else to fix it. In your case, you're not a writer, nor do you want to be one, so I can appreciate that and give what you are doing total respect.
I think what set me off was simply my perception, and the bit of curmudgeonry that I'm experiencing lately. After rereading these posts, a big part of me is wondering when exactly I became that dick that spurns creativity.
But please understand that where I'm coming from this is what happens: the markets get so completely and utterly clogged up with so much dribble that it makes it incredibly hard for new writers of real potential, and established writers with a history, to get their work into print--the markets can become completely bogged-down with the sheer volume of manuscripts to read through.
Now, this is the interesting part. Because the markets are flooded with dribble, the dribble becomes the norm. Reason? Since this is what is being written, then obviously this is what people want to read/view. An example of this is the sheer volume of utterly hideous teen-theme films being made. Or, we could go with yet another vampire novel--none of them are original in any shape or form, but they continue to get published in pursuit of a quick buck.
What does this have to do with you? Nothing. You just want to be the idea-man, the producer so-to-speek. But, not everyone has that realization.
Anyway, at least your idea has the potential to be different--if whomever writes it choses to avoid the obvious cliché--and to become something original and interesting. I hope it does, and wish you the best with it.
OT--since you're into music and film, have you watched the Flaming Lips' newest project Christmas on Mars?
Stitch on 14/1/2009 at 16:52
Quote Posted by Queue
Now, this is the interesting part. Because the markets are flooded with dribble, the dribble becomes the norm. Reason? Since this is what is being written, then obviously this is what people want to read/view. An example of this is the sheer volume of utterly hideous teen-theme films being made. Or, we could go with yet another vampire novel--none of them are original in any shape or form, but they continue to get published in pursuit of a quick buck.
While I agree with most of what you're saying, I think the above is the equivalent of a gourmet cook complaining that McDonald's is stealing their market. Sometimes people just like the sugar salt rush of a Big Mac, flooding the market has nothing to do with it.
The Twilight series is popular because it scratches a certain itch many readers have. Good writers (well, you know what I mean) may find this discouraging, but hopefully there's a market out there for them as well. I understand it may not seem like it if you're a struggling in obscurity, but there still are plenty of examples of great writers who have found an audience in the current climate.
Having said that, reading the last couple books in the Harry Potter series was a very depressing experience for this would-be writer.
Queue on 14/1/2009 at 16:57
I hear you there. The last book seemed as if she had no idea where she intended to go, but was more than willing to write a bunch of pages.
