Ko0K on 3/12/2006 at 22:29
Quote Posted by Vigil
* Whether or not you got immersed just comes down to your own personal taste and opinion;
Perhaps it's not fair to complain about lack of immersion when the premise of the book itself is of little interest to me, but I personally think that the introductory chapter in any book should have a good amount of appeal to the average reader who has not yet figured out if the book is anywhere near his taste.
P.S.: Doing more than kick a foggy idea of a book around in your head definitely takes balls, I must say. However, you should know that courage can be misguided when you fail to recognize your limitations. Sure, some of the shit that's said around here probably pisses you off, but there is usually something to take away once you look past the negativity.
Sypha Nadon on 3/12/2006 at 22:57
Stronts, I think I might have just been pissed off by someone else's comments when I responded back to you. I apologize. For the record, I wasn't even phased by the "campy gay shit" line or whatever it was you said.
Stitch, in regards to constructive criticism, I think the problem with this place isn't the criticism per se, but how it's delivered... often times, in a very antagonistic method. And it's not a matter of my skin being that thin... I mean, I found that old thread of the first time I ever had an MP3 of my music posted on here and people said things that were a thousand times more hurtful then anything to appear in this thread. But I have been hanging out with other writers recently, both online and in real life... one of the reasons why I'm not around here as much as I used to be, for that matter.
strangeblue, I do see merit in what you say, and I won't deny that I sometimes self-aggrandize (that's what happens when you discover Dali and Warhol at a young age)... I wouldn't call myself lazy though. First off, writing a 300+ page book is a lot of work. Then I had to proofread it myself, which took forever as I kept reading the book over and over again... I'm interested if you could be more specific about these "craft" flaws and this "sloppiness". And I did admit that much of the first chapter is awkward, but I think it gets smoother as it goes along. What I don't understand is why people seem to think of the first chapter as "gay", as other than the brief appearance by Sypha there's very little "homo" content.
kook, why would I bother writing about someone else's fantasy? I don't see any interest in doing that.
For the record, and I probably should have said this at the start of the thread, but... the main reason why I didn't seek out a traditional publisher was because I wanted the book published as soon as possible. One of my biggest worries in life, probably my biggest fear of all, would be that I'd die before getting a book out there. It was an obsession that's been hounding me for years now. And of course, being a total lunatic about my health, I was always worried that death was just around the corner. This summer, after finishing the book, I realized that self-publishing would be the quickest route possible. So that's the dominant reason I went that path (along with having almost complete creative control, of course). So I guess you could say I made the decision through desperation. It's not something I'd do a second time. I certainly want my second novel to be published in the traditional manner. Having said all that, I still think it's the best thing I've written up to this point in my life, but of course I want to take my writing to another level with the next book. So in a way this was sort of practice, to prove to myself that I could see a project to it's conclusion without wimping out at the last minute (how most of my writing projects end up). Fairly expensive practice, yes, but life's lessons are rarely pleasant. I'm just glad that I've done something, and though people might wonder how valid that something is, I still think it's better to do something then to do nothing. If anything, a lot of anxiety I've felt before in my life has, if not totally disappeared, at least vanished a bit. Should I have waited a bit longer? Maybe. But for better or worse what's done is done. There's nothing more for me to do now except concentrate on the next project.
And hey, I think I'm allowed to be utterly self-indulgent for at least one book, especially when you factor in that only a small handful of people are actually going to read this thing anyway.
Ko0K on 3/12/2006 at 23:04
Quote Posted by Sypha Nadon
kook, why would I bother writing about someone else's fantasy? I don't see any interest in doing that.
No, you should write your own fantasy, but shouldn't you make it inviting? Don't you think it's only fair for the people who will buy the book? Why would I want to read a book when it feels like a chore? I don't mean to be so straight, but that's just me being honest.
(edit) Also, it's probably a better idea to have someone else do the proof-reading. I write technical reports for work, and I am a firm-believer in peer reviews. Anyway, I do understand where you are coming from. It's not your fault if some people don't enjoy your book, really. Well, you asked for feedback, and apparently that's what you've got.
Vigil on 3/12/2006 at 23:20
Sypha, almost everybody is afraid of creative failure, and of being negatively judged - especially by others who have more experience than they do.
The people who aren't afraid of this either lie through their teeth to themselves or have accumulated enough experience and security that the failure will have no personal meaning to them.
You are afraid of a rejection letter.
You are afraid of a professional editor telling you things you don't want to hear about your creation, without validating any of your bullshit, without giving you any way to psychologically defuse their judgement of you.
This is perfectly normal. Writers are afraid of this. Even good, experienced ones. Especially new, unpublished ones.
So grow a pair and face that fear, instead of fobbing yourself off with a load of complete horseshit about how you only circumvented that painful and potentially humiliating process because you were afraid the book wouldn't be published in time for your impending doom.
Rug Burn Junky on 3/12/2006 at 23:41
Quote Posted by Vigil
Did I forget anything? Or have I covered every layer of insulation between Sypha Nadon and the outside world?
You left out the fact that any negative opinions are only based on biases and preconceived notions that he may have about Sypha.
Other than that, spot on.
Sypha Nadon on 4/12/2006 at 00:07
Vigil, you're totally off-base now. I really was scared of dying at the time, as my health was very bad, and I was in a bad mental state. There's no "horse shit" involved. That was the primary reason.
Sypha Nadon on 4/12/2006 at 00:26
Oh fuck's sake, no one believes what I say anyway, so I might as well just come clean. My real name isn't Sypha Nadon, it's Tagaz. I come from the planet Msu to warn you earthlings that the world will end on April 17, 2035, when the Dwarks invade. But if you all convert to Evoligion and build the Mothership and come to the Notikon Cluster you can still all be saved. This is Tagaz, signing off.
Stitch on 4/12/2006 at 00:29
Quote Posted by Sypha Nadon
I'm interested if you could be more specific about these "craft" flaws and this "sloppiness". And I did admit that much of the first chapter is awkward, but I think it gets smoother as it goes along.
Your opening paragraph alone is a difficult and awkward read because of craft flaws and sloppiness. To name a few:
* "...even if it were for just one second" isn't clear as to what "it" refers to.
* "...unimaginable. Imagine..." is awkward.
* "...shed the straight-jackets of restriction..." is redundant.
* "...and, working together, actually evolved..." is clumsy. "...and worked together to actually evolve" flows better.
* The enlightened species line runs on awkwardly.
* The entire passage is an exercise in cliche. I generally knew in advance what word or phrase was coming next.
My points may seem picky, but good prose should flow seamlessly, and speed bumps that cause readers to stop and reread a sentence for clarification are death to the pleasant reading experience.
Scots Taffer on 4/12/2006 at 00:47
Quote Posted by Strontium Dog
but you didn't want to take on the likes of Vigil, OB and Scots (people who genuinely savaged Sypha itt) because you perceived me as an easier target.
I've not savaged Sypha at all in this thread, have I? I merely thought the writing was clunky and the dialogue stilted but still wished him congratulations with whatever he hoped to achieve through self-publishing.
I also offered to further critique the work if he wanted (I have done this for others and they have appreciated it) but I sure as hell wouldn't pay for it as it looks like it's a first draft effort.
I poked fun at his HYPERREALISATION of the eighties, but not to be savage, just because it was quite lol to read.
MIAMI VICE
Oh and parker's sire was right on the money too with his post, Sypha, pay attention there.
Also:
Quote Posted by Sypha Nadon
... I'm interested if you could be more specific about these "craft" flaws and this "sloppiness".
The Elements of Style by Strunk and White
Read, rinse, repeat.