nobody on 28/3/2005 at 14:51
I'm wondering if it is possible to equip guards with more than one type of weapon. give them a sword and a bow with arrows. also I remember back in Dromed it was possible to give guards fire arrows or any other arrow you wanted. could this be done in the new editor? frankly T3Ed scares me. I know very little about mapping, edditing, scripting, . . . ok I know very little about computers period. I can operate one well enough to play video games and write emails and stories, and kep track of my bank account but that's about it for me, so I appologise if this is a really dumb question. it's just that I've played Theivery which is a mod of the UT and the guards in that carry both bows and melee weapons (mace or sword) so I thought maybe we could do it here.
anyway, thank you all for your time and patience.
p.s. I've said this a lot and I'm hoping some1 is working on it but the one thing I want to see fixed in T3Ed is the bug that keeps AI from hitting you when croutched (especially the hammerites). if it isn't fixed any FM based on hammerites will instantly suck because I'll be able to croutch my way through in broad light killing everyone i meet.
OrbWeaver on 28/3/2005 at 15:11
Quote Posted by nobody
. if it isn't fixed any FM based on hammerites will instantly suck because I'll be able to croutch my way through in broad light killing everyone i meet.
So don't do that then. It is not difficult to voluntarily avoid gameplay techniques that you know give you an unfair advantage: like not killing everybody you meet with broadheads even though the game allows you to do this.
As far as multiple weapons goes, it may be possible but I would guess that this would require custom code to get the guard to choose between more than one type of weapon, which probably does not exist in the current game.
rujuro on 28/3/2005 at 16:00
Sort of beside the point, but which AI does this bug affect. I actually never even encountered it on my playthrough, probably because I would never go toe to toe with a guard under any circumstances.
I tested it in the museum and was one dead taffer, so is it just hammerites and Kurshock? Or what?
nobody on 28/3/2005 at 20:01
Quote Posted by rujuro
Sort of beside the point, but which AI does this bug affect. I actually never even encountered it on my playthrough, probably because I would never go toe to toe with a guard under any circumstances.
I tested it in the museum and was one dead taffer, so is it just hammerites and Kurshock? Or what?
Hammerite guards and those rogues with the hammers (in the pagan tunnels) can't touch you, Kurshok, and statues will occasionally get a hit in but not often enough to keep you from killing them. the big rat beast in the pagan tunnels can't hit you in certain tunnels but that's a bit different.
I discovered this by mistake once when I got caught trying to creap past a hammerite in St. Edgar's. and this is why I disagree with orbweaver that it isn't a big deal. say I'm sneaking along and get surprised by a hammerite should I stand up into his swinging hammer? yes, I know I probably should because I should be dead anyway, but I'm not. why should I have to stand up into the hammerite's weapon just because he's too lame to hit me when I'm low. I don't like going toe-to-toe with AI but I do like close calls, and that means getting caught and also sometimes escaping after getting caught. I love a good chase sometimes but it kills my motivation when I know all I have to do is croutch.
P.S. I'd be happy if we could edit hammerite properties so they fight like sword guards. yeah, it might look a little funny waving around a hammer like a sword, but I think it would an improvement. not sure if that's even possible though.
Bho on 28/3/2005 at 22:33
That's not entirely true, nobody. If you give them enough time, hammerites, kurshock and statues will all hit you while crouching. The reason behind this is that while these three AI's all have a 'downwards swing' attack which hits you when crouching, they use it very rarely, meaning why people can kill them while crouching easily.
And as for the point about knowing about the hammer - crouch bug, i ask you to consider the lean-foward blackjack technique in thief 1&2. I recently tried to play through T2 using this technique as much as possible and the game was much, much easier. Now, i'm sure you know about this particular technique, and refrain from using it as it would probably kill your motivation too. :) So why don't you do the same for this bug?
nomad of the pacific on 29/3/2005 at 00:05
Back to the issue of giving guards multiple weapons, I tried this before using a custom weapon and it worked... sort of. The guard initially used the weapon I attached to him in preference to his assigned sword, which still showed up on his belt. Very promising! :) But later I saw the guard with both my weapon and his sword drawn at the same time, :laff: so there are still issues to resolve.
In the case of giving a guard a sword and bow, maybe a script could determine which he used based on the distance from the player.
nobody on 29/3/2005 at 00:46
hmmm, the lean-jack thing never made me invulnerable once i got caught. yes, I've seen the hammerite jumping overhead swing and I know it hits croutched thieves but i've only seen it used as an opening attack and even then only rarely. to test this "bug" I did the clock tower mission in broad light never in shadows and I made it through without ever being hit by a hammer. got hit once by a priest fire-shot. nor did I kill any hammerites I just pushed my way through to the objectives.
nobody on 29/3/2005 at 00:47
Quote Posted by nomad of the pacific
Back to the issue of giving guards multiple weapons, I tried this before using a custom weapon and it worked... sort of. The guard initially used the weapon I attached to him in preference to his assigned sword, which still showed up on his belt. Very promising! :) But later I saw the guard with both my weapon and his sword drawn at the same time, :laff: so there are still issues to resolve.
In the case of giving a guard a sword and bow, maybe a script could determine which he used based on the distance from the player.
Beautiful! PErFECT! there is much hope! thank you!
Maximius on 29/3/2005 at 21:51
I did not realize that the Hammers could rarely hit you if you crouched. Thats a RIDICULOUS bug, and not one I would care to simply play around. It is a blow to the realism of the game, one of its strongest attributes.
We know that the Hammers can swing overhead and hit Garrett when he's crouched, is it possible to simply make those AIs who do so swing overhead more often? I dont know crap about the scripting, I can barely build a cube shaped room in T3ED, but it seems that if the scripting exists to make them do the overhead swing, its frequency could be raised. It wouldnt even matter if Garrett isnt crouching, and I can forgive a few wild horizontal swings that miss a crouched thief as long as the next few crush his brainpan.
Max
Maximius on 29/3/2005 at 22:02
Quote Posted by nobody
P.S. I'd be happy if we could edit hammerite properties so they fight like sword guards. yeah, it might look a little funny waving around a hammer like a sword, but I think it would an improvement. not sure if that's even possible though.
Thats not such a far stretch nobody. I remember reading a book of Celtic history a while ago and they had several pictures of war hammers. They were not the huge mallets the Hammers carry, like circus peg hammers, they were long and slender with smaller leaner heads on them. Most seemed like a meaner version of the modern rock hammer, a heavy side for crushing and a pointed or edged side for piercing armor. The point is they were much lighter looking than the ones the Hammers carry and could probably be wielded one handedly. Would it be hard to take a guard AI, replace the sword mesh with a realistic war hammer, then give him a change of uniform and voila, a realistic Hammer that isnt totally blown away by umm, err, crouching?
max
here is a website with some pics
(
http://www.medieval-weaponry.com/index.html?lang=en-us&target=d748.html&lmd=38401.446840)
