jprobs on 21/2/2006 at 02:19
Motorcycles...
-Brother broke his collar bone slipping on sand going about 5mph.
-Watched a guy wipe out and hit a curb with his temple and was instantly dead.
-Friend in high school tried to "eat" a phone pole on his motorcycle.. they had to dig pieces of his skull from it.
-Had another high scool friend paralyzed from the neck down when rear ended by a cop at a stoplight.. He sued the city and got rich. It pays for his diapers.
-Had another friend break his shoulder blade (yep, you can actually break it) on his 17th birthday and shattered his femur on his 18th birthday (he has not gone out on his birthday for 22 years)
I grew up in the mid 80s when moped were the craze and can give you many stories about those as well.
"murder" cycles would be a more appropriate name.... gas is cheaper than brain damage.
harley on 21/2/2006 at 04:01
Quote Posted by Printer's Devil
The local forecast predicts subzero temperatures for another week. I've never been quite so eager for spring to arrive, with that sexy machine waiting in the garage. Hey Harley, you live in Colorado, right? When it comes to proper traction on a motorcycle, how cold is too cold?
Well, an exact temp I can't give you. But I will say this. I have rode in the low 40's(for sure 43). Mind you I have no windshield, helmut(uh oh here comes the criticism) so it's pretty cold that low. I believe I have rode in the thirties but never verified it. Anyway the other day a couple of buddies and I decided to go for a ride. Had to be in the low 50's. I pulled across main st and nailed second gear. Yep, you guessed it. The rear tire broke loose. No big deal, It's happened before but it went a little farther this time than when it happens in summer. And it's all because of the cold ground. Your traction is effected but I can't tell you exactly when. The rubber in the tire gets hard and doesn't grab. Oh, I didn't wreck either:thumb:
I would say the colder you venture to go out in, the more care you must take. You could ride in any temp as long as your carefull.
Braking is a big deal too. Most people are afraid to use the front brake for fear of the front tire sliding out and wrecking. I will say this, MASTER the front brake. It helps you out a LOT more than the rear.
That vid that komag(Edit-not Komag, it was Printer's Devil, sorry) linked to was pretty cool. Granted I don't know if there was traffic right behind the rider or what but in my opinion whoever was on the bike tried to drive to the side to miss the car instead of hitting both skids hard and just not hitting it at all.
In my opinion they should have mashed on the front and rear hard and stopped that way. I think they might have made it. Opinion, of course I wasn't there. I just never saw the front end dive like I think it should have. You'd be suprised at what a bike will slow down in when both brakes are hit properly.
Another thing that helped me out personally was riding motocross and supercross when I was younger. Granted you don't really want to be that close to cars but when you have 40 bikes funneled into a 5 bike corner it gets a person used to tight quarters and really getting familiar with panic situations. There several other things, it would just be forever to type it all. I really think it helped me more than anything. I could remember hitting the front brake hard enough to do a backwards wheelie(dirtbike, not my Harley.) You get that down and you can really stop a bike in no time or minimal space as well.
Bored yet?
Here is a good scenario I like to talk to people about. Lets say your going around a gradual left hand turn at say 30 mph in your car. You see an extra damn large Burger King drink cup in the road that is now flat. You don't even care about it in your car because it will do nothing. Now take the same corner on your Motorcycle and hit it with the front tire. After your done picking your ass out of the curb you will realize when one of two tires is gone, so are you. My point-you HAVE to drive completely different on a bike than you do in a car. That fine sand they put down for ice will literally kill you. Got to be careful.
OK-little input for my no helmut comment. It pisses me off to think I have to wear a helmut, even though I know it's safer. It should be my choice if I want to take the chance of messing up my noggen more than it already is. My 2 cents!
harley on 21/2/2006 at 04:16
Quote Posted by jprobs
Motorcycles...
-Brother broke his collar bone slipping on sand going about 5mph.
-Watched a guy wipe out and hit a curb with his temple and was instantly dead.
-Friend in high school tried to "eat" a phone pole on his motorcycle.. they had to dig pieces of his skull from it.
-Had another high scool friend paralyzed from the neck down when rear ended by a cop at a stoplight.. He sued the city and got rich. It pays for his diapers.
-Had another friend break his shoulder blade (yep, you can actually break it) on his 17th birthday and shattered his femur on his 18th birthday (he has not gone out on his birthday for 22 years)
I grew up in the mid 80s when moped were the craze and can give you many stories about those as well.
"murder" cycles would be a more appropriate name.... gas is cheaper than brain damage.
I would say that you have seen more than your share of tragic bike wrecks(or mopeds) I may not ride if I were you either.
My friendly argument is this though. Maybe none of them new how to ride. Showing off(not saying they were, just that it's probably the worst thing you can do, and a 17 year old may be doing that to impress chics or something---speculation) I see people all the time ride that shouldn't have a motorcycle. I believe there should be way tougher laws on getting a motorcycle endorsement. Just because someone has 25 to 30 grand to go blow on a Screaming Eagle Fat Boy doesn't mean they can ride. All that means is they can afford one and some people buy them just for the name. "Yep, got a Harley in my garage!" Good for you, it 5 years old and has 498 miles on it. Sweet, you rock. OK, I'm getting off subject.
I see it all the time where I live. I'm not bad mouthing your bro or friends. I have seen too many get wrapped up in something cool that shouldn't. I could be wrong with every case you wrote down or know about, but it does exist. And I'm sure it's not just where I live.
Also, you can't blame the bike for somebody getting rearended by a cop. Who knows how bad or better off he would have been if he were in a car. Hard to say. Chances are, he'd been safer in a car or truck.
As far as mopeds are concern. That was the dumbest thing companies could have done. Sometimes it's nice to have people actually be able to see you, and sometimes when a little power is needed, it's nice to have. Which mopeds can't brag about either one. Nor can scooters.
I think murdercycle is unfair. Kinda funny, but unfair. They may not be as safe as cars, but neither is walking or riding a pedal bike. I think of myself as a very experienced rider and could get killed on it the next time I ride it. I hope not, but it's possible. I could also get killed in my car or pickup on my way to work too. I need another beer. Your turn.
edit, boy I can't spell
Printer's Devil on 21/2/2006 at 06:12
Thanks for the information, Harley. IIRC, the forum where that crash video was initially posted seemed sympathetic but many viewers pointed out that hard braking would have saved the day. Quite a few riders are afraid of locking up the front binders and get spooked when they start sliding against the tank, so they lack to confidence to brake properly. Most riding skills are fairly counterintuitive and require constant practice, which is why I'm itching to get out.
As for your decision to forgo a helmet, it's not that much different from the choice between driving a car or riding a motorcycle. Cars are inherently safer and practical while bikes are great fun and very cool. The rewards are as real as the risks--which is what a lot of folks fail to realize, especially those tired taunters (ever heard donorcycle or half-hearse?).
Komag on 21/2/2006 at 07:01
Quote Posted by jprobs
Motorcycles...
-Brother broke his collar bone slipping on sand going about 5mph.
-Watched a guy wipe out and hit a curb with his temple and was instantly dead.
-Friend in high school tried to "eat" a phone pole on his motorcycle.. they had to dig pieces of his skull from it.
-Had another high scool friend paralyzed from the neck down when rear ended by a cop at a stoplight.. He sued the city and got rich. It pays for his diapers.
-Had another friend break his shoulder blade (yep, you can actually break it) on his 17th birthday and shattered his femur on his 18th birthday (he has not gone out on his birthday for 22 years)
I would just say remind me never to go anywhere near you because you obviously give off really bad motorcycle karma vibes! :o :o :o
jprobs on 21/2/2006 at 12:18
Quote Posted by Komag
I would just say remind me never to go anywhere near you because you obviously give off really bad motorcycle karma vibes! :o :o :o
Geez Komag.. I never considered it was my fault :eek:
I guess my point was, don't consider a motorcycle based on fuel economy. It's not worth the risk. I myself owned a Honda Nighthawk S (I think it was a 750) but only for about 1 month. I realized people in cars just don't see you on a motorcycle. I had enough close calls in a month that I decided to sell it..... Maybe it is me :D
Printer's Devil on 21/2/2006 at 13:15
Quote Posted by jprobs
Geez Komag...I realized people in cars just don't see you on a motorcycle. I had enough close calls in a month that I decided to sell it..... Maybe it is me :D
That's a central truth, alright. It was also my first lesson in traffic awareness while training. Consider yourself invisible
and silent! If any drivers notice you, most will be concerned with their schedule, not your safety. The second was: always have an escape plan, regardless of the situation. Even at a stop. Sound difficult? It is, and it takes constant practice, which is why smaller bikes are recommended for beginners (<500cc). If you can't control a light machine well enough to swerve around a truck, or come to a sudden stop, then a powerful engine or twitchy racing suspension won't save you, either. Here's hoping you get on a bike again someday, jprobs.
harley on 21/2/2006 at 14:28
Quote Posted by jprobs
I guess my point was, don't consider a motorcycle based on fuel economy. It's not worth the risk.
I will say that you have a real good point there. Many people are getting them because of the price of fuel. At least the thread starter is asking for help and getting some really sound advice in my opinion. Some people won't have the experience of others to knock around while they decide what to do. Hopefully they will learn it the easy way and not the alternative.
PigLick on 21/2/2006 at 15:27
I dont think anyone really thinks about buying a bike cos of the economic factor. Bikes are just badass.
harley on 21/2/2006 at 16:56
Quote Posted by PigLick
I dont think anyone really thinks about buying a bike cos of the economic factor. Bikes are just badass.
I agree, but people do buy scooters for economic reasons. That is the number one reason people come to our shop to look at scooters. You start toting 80 or 100 mpg or whatever and it will turn heads.
Bikes are a different story. Everyone says to me "hell, you probably get great milage on your Harley, or what kind of mileage do you get on your bike?" My answer "Who cares!"
If you really look at what it cost to buy lets say my Harley to saving on fuel. If the fuel cost went up 1 dollar a gallon in the next year, It would still take forever to pay off. I'm not sure if it ever will. Plus, it wouldn't happen in a years time and who knows what the price will be two or three years down the road. All that being said, now factor in tires, services, brakes, insurance, etc.
