WingedKagouti on 13/10/2023 at 13:45
Quote Posted by heywood
Hamas is not a small group of terrorists, and it was more of a military operation than a terrorist attack.
The situation with Hamas is a bit more complex than that, there are several sub-groups of Hamas. The simplified version is that the political branch and the militant branch are effectively separate entities with a historical connection. While the two branches grew from the same group, they have had different views on the conflict for decades.
And I'm specifically calling it the militant branch, because they don't encompass the entire armed force and they include civilians. Their methods lean towards terrorist attacks and guerilla warfare, and many of the members are highly radicalized, believing they're fighting a holy war that can only end with the destruction of Israel and their allies.
The political branch has been working for a peaceful solution to the situation even before Hamas was recognized as the government, they're currently in a very weak position both internally and on a geopolitical scale.
All of Hamas has recieved support from Iran in various ways.
Tocky on 13/10/2023 at 14:24
I was perma banned from reddit for saying that if it were not for the Muslim hatred of the Jewish state existing there would be peace now. I thought that was common knowledge. Muslims hate that all of the Ottoman empire was not divided up among them with no other religion considered. There were Jews in the area of Israel before and after WWII and when Germany was exterminating them Muslims in Jerusalem thought that was a good idea and joined in massacres even then. They supported Hitler. That isn't a secret. Little wonder the losers of WWII had to accept a Jewish state. Only they didn't and tried to eliminate it three times.
But I was banned for that. It was termed harassment. Likely someone just reported me for harassment and the auto feature there does not allow for actual human thinking and just takes that persons word.
Everybody wants to blame Israel for over winning the conflict. I too want them to adhere to the 1967 borders which were signed at the end of that war but you have to remember that though Palestine signed that agreement they reneged on it soon after. It went back to Israel has no right to exist. It's a sad situation but Israel will over win. Every time. They see themselves as fighting for their existence. Because they are and have been since the creation of the state.
mxleader on 13/10/2023 at 16:24
One of the more disturbing things I've noticed is that many people are taking sides here in the US and in other countries as if it was a soccer match or football game.
Where can I buy a jersey to support my team?
Pyrian on 13/10/2023 at 17:04
Quote Posted by Starker
...the US has never promised to protect Canada.
Canada's in NATO, dude.
SD on 13/10/2023 at 18:03
Quote Posted by Nameless Voice
Attacking civilians is never okay, but I don't see how we can expect anything else from a people who have been living in a giant concentration camp for decades while the rest of the world actively cheer on their oppressors.
Do concentration camps generally have five-star hotels, restaurants, jewellers, swimming pools and luxury malls?
Tocky on 13/10/2023 at 18:21
Also how did they get in that concentration camp? Was it from importing missiles to shoot at Israelis so they had to be fenced and controlled or they would keep doing it? I'll give you a hint: YES IT WAS. That and suicide bombing busloads of Israelis.
I've also heard it described as an open air prison. How do folks get in prison again?
What was the reason for the blockade again?
heywood on 13/10/2023 at 18:48
Quote Posted by WingedKagouti
The situation with Hamas is a bit more complex than that, there are several sub-groups of Hamas. The simplified version is that the political branch and the militant branch are effectively separate entities with a historical connection. While the two branches grew from the same group, they have had different views on the conflict for decades.
And I'm specifically calling it the militant branch, because they don't encompass the entire armed force and they include civilians. Their methods lean towards terrorist attacks and guerilla warfare, and many of the members are highly radicalized, believing they're fighting a holy war that can only end with the destruction of Israel and their allies.
The political branch has been working for a peaceful solution to the situation even before Hamas was recognized as the government, they're currently in a very weak position both internally and on a geopolitical scale.
All of Hamas has recieved support from Iran in various ways.
Are you suggesting Ismail Haniyeh wasn't in on this? I would like to see any evidence of a split in Hamas between Haniyeh and Mohammad Deif. I think what you're describing is the fantasy we sold ourselves in 2006 after Hamas won the election.
SD on 13/10/2023 at 18:52
Quote Posted by Tocky
I was perma banned from reddit for saying that if it were not for the Muslim hatred of the Jewish state existing there would be peace now. I thought that was common knowledge. Muslims hate that all of the Ottoman empire was not divided up among them with no other religion considered. There were Jews in the area of Israel before and after WWII and when Germany was exterminating them Muslims in Jerusalem thought that was a good idea and joined in massacres even then. They supported Hitler. That isn't a secret. Little wonder the losers of WWII had to accept a Jewish state. Only they didn't and tried to eliminate it three times.
But I was banned for that. It was termed harassment. Likely someone just reported me for harassment and the auto feature there does not allow for actual human thinking and just takes that persons word.
Everybody wants to blame Israel for over winning the conflict. I too want them to adhere to the 1967 borders which were signed at the end of that war but you have to remember that though Palestine signed that agreement they reneged on it soon after. It went back to Israel has no right to exist. It's a sad situation but Israel will over win. Every time. They see themselves as fighting for their existence. Because they are and have been since the creation of the state.
What you wrote was completely sane, reasonable and level-headed, so it's not surprising it earned you a ban from Reddit.
I couldn't say I approve of every action Israel takes, but they're up against an enemy that craves their annihilation. They won't take lectures from us here in the West, because whatever action Israel takes, you can bet we went further during WWII, when we too were in a fight for our own existence.
I recall how the Camp David talks collapsed because Yasser Arafat wouldn't accept shared custody of the Temple Mount. It was his contention that there was never any Jewish temple on the site, a popular belief in Palestinian circles.
The entire Palestinian cause is rooted on the idea that Jews are alien interlopers rather than being indigenous to the region. Accepting Jewish indigeneity to Judea would mean accepting that Jews have a valid claim to live on the land.
It's ahistorical and preposterous - if you dig anywhere under the soil there, you'll find 3,000 years of Jewish history, not 3,000 years of Palestinian history - but denying reality is the only way they can win, and they've somehow managed to gull many in the West into believing that they, the Palestinians, are the real natives.
Until the Palestinians (most of whom - ironically - are relatively recent migrants to the Land of Israel) can accept the presence of Jewish people in their traditional tribal lands, peace will not be possible.
Yakoob on 13/10/2023 at 19:27
Quote Posted by mxleader
One of the more disturbing things I've noticed is that many people are taking sides here in the US and in other countries as if it was a soccer match or football game.
Where can I buy a jersey to support my team?
[video=youtube;a0Pw_TxBe7w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0Pw_TxBe7w[/video]
