SolidSnakeRoll on 24/10/2023 at 15:21
I vote for a wall.
Not saying its the best idea but for an extreme situation it sounds like it could be only case where less war is good. And then Dome of Rock can simply work like a Vatican state thing where 2 hours is between jews and muslims to visit or something.
But i guess Israel vs Palestine feels like Ireland vs Britain etc. For one, i am in favor that i do think Northern Ireland should go to Ireland, but i also dont want any ultranationalist nonsense war about it either
By a miracle a Good Friday Agreement inspired deal would have been the nicest thing to happen
lowenz on 24/10/2023 at 19:45
Quote Posted by RippedPhreak
The various branches of Islam don't matter. The most fanatical ones with the most guns will be setting the direction. For example there might be many Palestinians who disapprove of the Hamas invasion and massacre, but they could not or would not stop it. Thus their opinion didn't matter.
The only opinions that mattered were the ones with the guns and willingness to kill.
Just do not supply guns :p
mxleader on 24/10/2023 at 20:08
Quote Posted by lowenz
Just do not supply guns :p
Is it okay to supply them with Toyota trucks still?
Nicker on 26/10/2023 at 02:49
Can we change the title of this thread to something more honest?
How about "Hamas and Likud don't give a shit how many of their own people they get killed"?
Or, "Likud and Hamas pick a fight neither deserve to win"?
Or, "Fascists come in all shades"?
Suggestions?
Quote:
You can't negotiate with someone who wants to wipe you off the face of the planet.
Tell that to the Likud Party. Just because they use starvation, rather than rockets, doesn't make them any better than Hamas.
lowenz on 26/10/2023 at 08:02
Quote Posted by mxleader
Is it okay to supply them with Toyota trucks still?
Not so deadly.
The problem with Islamic terrorism is that "Islam+liberation rhethoric" can't be suppressed without admitting the all "rights" thing is autodestructive and dangerous. You give people freedom of thought and the promise of a better future maybe in a (religious or political) doctrinal frame, you give people rage and the desire of vengeance, the worst thing being the possibility to manipulate people to commit theirself to the
horror.
It's really simple to transform desperate people into animals pledged to martyrdom fantasies so you can use them as effective weapons.
Because, let's be honest, we're talking about people that LOVE to kill and die. That's the problem, they've learned to love the horror just like a drug.
Quote:
How about "Hamas and Likud don't give a shit how many of their own people they get killed"?
They sacrifice people because someone teach them the
greater good ideology, problem being we (as humans) are still susceptible to that promise with no hard limits.
It can be a religious belief, it can be a political belief (and with Islam they overlap, just like with Zionism): it always acts just as an override to human basic conscience, so you can see the other humans as legit targets and in the end preys to hunt down.
SD on 26/10/2023 at 09:53
Quote Posted by Nicker
Tell that to the Likud Party. Just because they use starvation, rather than rockets, doesn't make them any better than Hamas.
And yet there are more Palestinians than at any point in history.
Nicker on 26/10/2023 at 12:22
There are also more Israelis.
Statistics. Use them sparsely and wisely.
What about the fact that both sides are engaged in violent crimes to advance their ideology? You know, substance.
Nicker on 26/10/2023 at 12:25
Quote Posted by lowenz
They sacrifice people because someone teach them the
greater good ideology, problem being we (as humans) are still susceptible to that promise with no hard limits.
It can be a religious belief, it can be a political belief (and with Islam they overlap, just like with Zionism): it always acts just as an override to human basic conscience, so you can see the other humans as legit targets and in the end preys to hunt down.
Hence my prior assertion that belief in the afterlife is the most poisonous fantasy ever invented by humans. It is if not the root of these justifications, then the lever used to move frightened people into horrendous actions they would normally never even consider.
lowenz on 26/10/2023 at 19:29
Quote Posted by Nicker
Hence my prior assertion that belief in the afterlife is the most poisonous fantasy ever invented by humans. It is if not the root of these justifications, then the lever used to move frightened people into horrendous actions they would normally never even consider.
Still the human mind creates the fantasy (by itself) and, worst, created the political framework to save&promote it ("the right of tought /freedom of speech") so someone within us - maybe not even believing in "afterlife" or whatelse - can easely trick&hijack desperate minds in a perfect juridical correct way just using&feeding rage, desperation and the "believe" to make the horror real. This people LOVE the idea to create a nightmarish world, better, to make the world become a mirror of their own inner nightmare (stupid narcissists think it's a "dreamworld", high intelligent psychopaths know it's hell and they actively work to establish it until the chaos surges with spikes so high that can comprise their own projects/lives, in a very lovecraftian derangement of the mind). And there's a lot of disposable pawns.
This dynamic is pervasive and it's the real "inner" enemy to humankind progress.
Qooper on 26/10/2023 at 20:02
Quote Posted by Nicker
Hence my prior assertion that belief in the afterlife is the most poisonous fantasy ever invented by humans. It is if not the root of these justifications, then the lever used to move frightened people into horrendous actions they would normally never even consider.
The same could be said about politics. Like I mentioned earlier, I hear this statement a lot about religion being the root of all evil, in exactly this kind of general form as a blanket statement. However, this thread is about Hamas' attack on Israel, so let's not go too deeply into religion here.
