Crion on 6/12/2003 at 03:08
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I'm a little pissed over the bit about controls.
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From Page 2So what do you do? Do you simplify controls for console players, and risk disappointing PC players? Do you craft different games that exploit the available input device(s) to the max?
Different games? How does having a "drag and drop" and mouse based UI make the games different?
This just before he explains that it didn't affect the core gameplay. True as that is, leaving it wouldn't affect it either.
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Also pissed over the crap about the unified ammo. More hardcore? Pah. The same could have been achived far better by lowering the amount of ammo pickup in game in regards to the difficulty level. Again,
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From Page 4Powerful a piece of hardware as it is, the Xbox has only 64megs of RAM, putting some significant constraints on map size, most notably, which means the PC version probably has more map loads than it might if we hadn't concerned ourselves with the Xbox (or if we'd been willing to create, tune and debug two radically different games).
Console port indeed. :nono:
I do wonder though, does this mean Thief 3 won't have those huge maps and will be forced to Xbox sized ones given that it's getting the same dual development treatment as DX:IW did?
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From Page 4But (and now I'm talking to the PC players out there) do me a favor and download our patch before you pass judgment!
:wot:
There was a time I was willing to believe that all of the design changes that have been greatly frowned upon were due to Warren Spector not having full reign over the development but with this kind of talk, well, maybe he has passed his prime.
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Gingerbread Man on 6/12/2003 at 04:15
All that talk about getting the patch confused me, as well. I haven't found one. Maybe he means the .ini tweak thing, which doesn't necessarily fix anything (didn't help me much at all) and isn't a patch at all anyway.
Unless he meant "get the patch - it's inevitable and will be coming as fast as we can produce it"
Which makes me get all frothy at the mouth about companies who release games and then release a slew of patches immediately afterwards. That basically says to me that they wanted to use a paying fanbase as a free QA division. And okay, you can get a much better (and faster) buglist that way, and one which crosses many different system specs, but come on.
twisty on 6/12/2003 at 10:34
Hmnn...As much as I revere Warren Spector and the games that he's had a hand in over the years, he sounds just like a coked up salesman at times these days. First he pleads for us to "Don't judge the full game by the demo", and now he's asking for us to "do me (WS) a favor and download our patch before you pass judgment!". Its kind of like a band saying "look, I know you guys didn't like the single that much, but you'll dig the rest of the album. We promise."; and then, on the album's release date, coming out with "you might not like the album now, but just wait until we release some free singles that you can download from the internet to add to your album, and then tell us what you think."
I know that’s a bit of a stretch, as far as an example is concerned, but I do feel that a lot of the public statements that we get from IS come across as less sincere then what I am used to hearing from LGS and some of the other great gaming companies over the years.
Maybe I'm just naïve. Although I must admit that I haven't played the full game yet, let alone the patched version :p.
Alneyan on 6/12/2003 at 10:43
I don't exactly like the comment about map sizes. Was I the only one who finds there was already *many* loads in Deus Ex? I do hope it won't be the case for Thief 3, when/if I am able to play this game. I read quite a few months ago there would be even bigger maps, such as a whole city. It would seem like it is the opposite which is in fact happening.
daveodeth on 6/12/2003 at 14:01
i frankly would feel better if he would just turn around and tell PC gamers to "fuck off we don't need you anymore", at least then i would know where he stood.
I was annoyed at bioware for Kotor, but after the time and effort they put into the PC version i have nothing but respect for them. And there customer support is second to none. If only IS were like that.
Vivian on 6/12/2003 at 17:21
I for one would be happier if they did the dual development thing in one of two ways:
a) develop it just for the x-box first. Use the revenue from that to fund the development of a pc version with dedicated interface, increased map size, environment detail and poly-complexity, and the extra little details that us pc types love so much.
Or...
b) develop it for the pc first with full on detail and content, then use the revenue from sales of that to develop a more stripped-down console version with a control system and game dynamic aimed at console controls and capabilities. Like the did with DX:1, in fact.
You see if you don't do it that way, you either get a mainly console-orientated or a mainly pc-orientated game, which is going to piss one lot of players off, or you get a game which doesn't work that great on either, which is going to piss EVERYONE off.
I'm not sure what they've done with DX:IW, as i haven't played the x-box version yet, but i'd hazard a guess that it wasn't designed for the PC.
ESpark on 6/12/2003 at 17:32
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develop it for the pc first with full on detail and content, then use the revenue from sales of that to develop a more stripped-down console version with a control system and game dynamic aimed at console controls and capabilities. Like the did with DX:1, in fact.
Someone on another forum told me the PS version of DX sold more than the PC version did. Guess what kinda gamer they'll listen to.
-ô_ô- on 6/12/2003 at 17:48
I guess that means the PS2 version is higher quality, eh? :joke:
Nalar on 6/12/2003 at 22:29
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Originally posted by twisty Hmnn...As much as I revere Warren Spector and the games that he's had a hand in over the years, he sounds just like a coked up salesman at times these days. First he pleads for us to "Don't judge the full game by the demo", and now he's asking for us to "do me (WS) a favor and download our patch before you pass judgment!". Its kind of like a band saying "look, I know you guys didn't like the single that much, but you'll dig the rest of the album. We promise."; and then, on the album's release date, coming out with "you might not like the album now, but just wait until we release some free singles that you can download from the internet to add to your album, and then tell us what you think."
I know that’s a bit of a stretch, as far as an example is concerned, but I do feel that a lot of the public statements that we get from IS come across as less sincere then what I am used to hearing from LGS and some of the other great gaming companies over the years.
Maybe I'm just naïve. Although I must admit that I haven't played the full game yet, let alone the patched version :p.
Hmmm... Good metaphor.
As for the patch, he didn't think IGN would be posting it so soon; it's apparently in development, and the only confirmed change is a quicksave/load button.
It shouldn't have been a mystery where this game was headed... console development costs are far lower and profits are higher, especially for Xbox. It all comes down to the $, and we should have known that from the first.
