redface on 2/9/2011 at 23:00
Quote Posted by Volitions Advocate
People complained about the shared ammo in IW, but in reality it made the game more challenging.
And that made the game more challenging... by not having to care about ammo matching guns anymore? Seriously?
Volitions Advocate on 3/9/2011 at 02:35
Absolutely. As it is, when i play Deus Ex I'm walking around with half the ammo full and almost never used. I can pistol anybody i want to death until my ammo is scarce and then switch weapons to the assault rifle I haven't used at all, and end up with a buttload of ammo.
In IW you can't do that. You're always on the search for ammo because you can't just stockpile it in your magic bag.
If a game with the mechanics of IW were relased first, then DX afterward, everybody would have loved IW as an immersive and emergent game. Everybody harps on IW like it was a dynasty warriors clone or something.
june gloom on 3/9/2011 at 02:45
They harp on it because it's shit.
Papy on 3/9/2011 at 03:36
Quote Posted by Volitions Advocate
In IW you can't do that. You're always on the search for ammo because you can't just stockpile it in your magic bag.
I wish I could have played with your version of IW. With mine, ammo were so plentiful that I never really thought about it.
Again, IW was not a challenging game. The Spy Drone and a few shots here and there with the Mag Rail were enough to breeze through the game. Except for the very beginning of the game (when you didn't have the Spy Drone maxed out nor the Mag Rail) there was rarely a need for anything else.
Of course you could limit yourself to not use any Biomods, nor the Mag Rail, and I guess not allowing those would tax your ammo reserve, but if you play that way, you are not playing with a game, but with a toy.
Warren's Spectre on 3/9/2011 at 15:00
I agree with the Op's premise for not loving Human Revolution. It's an alright game emerging from a slew of shite games over the past few years and how does it stick out from the crowd? Recycling some game mechanics from a game that came out a decade ago.
Was the story any good?
No it was terrible as it took a long time to get going (which can be an effective technique if used right) and then just ends by you ploughing your way through the requisite zombie quota of any current gen game and then using a vending machine style ending system where this time round, 'I'll take good guy ending even though I killed everyone in the game' which launches a video in which Adam proclaims, ' I showed real restraint when I could have killed everyone LOL.'
The Graphics?
Consolised as consolised can be. Used heavy 2D a lot of the time for the scenery that they sincerely hoped you wouldn't go near and the environment textures are about a quarter the size of New Visions.
The gameplay?
'In the original Deus Ex you could lift fridges and boxes, that's the key thing we've got to remember. Oh and a basketball court cuz we heard you like games so we put a game...' - Eidos Montreal
Third person sucked because I was playing a FPS. Takedowns sucked unless I'm missing some hidden in game description about how it's an Aug that freezes time. Your actions having no consequence sucked for instance when you have to ask Tong for his help at breaking into the docks you can kill everyone of his employees including the ones that are guarding his door and then when it skips to cutscene mode Tong is like an old buddy, 'alright man, you want to break into Belltower? Yeah no problem I'll help, I'll not ask why or notice how many of my employees you just killed.'
Aquinas on 3/9/2011 at 16:03
Quote Posted by thiefinthedark
...
God help us all when this team drops Thiaf...
I agree with what you said, I also stated very similar stuff elsewhere. This game is only a shadow of DX1's glory.
The problem is that today games aren't made by nerds for nerds. They are made by uninspired people for money. Since the masses dropped into gaming everything became utter shit. Just look what became out of BioWare, Blizzard...
There are only very few games I found enjoyable in the recent years: Hitman: Blood Money, Fallout 3 / New Vegas/ Minecraft (Terraria). That's about it. We would have to go back to Morrowind again to find something cool. We live in times where people seriously call Bioshock a successor to SS2 (:eww:)
I'm already shaking, when I think what Eidos Montreal will do to my all-time-favourite Thief. I fear they will rape Garrett just like Lucas/Spielberg did with Indy.
Where have all the good games gone?
Renault on 3/9/2011 at 16:29
Quote Posted by thiefinthedark
God help us all when this team drops Thiaf...
Except that...they aren't. Completely different team.
june gloom on 3/9/2011 at 18:13
Quote Posted by Aquinas
Where have all the good games gone?
They're still there. The problem isn't that they're no longer made by nerds for nerds. The problem is that they're not made for a bunch of useless tools stuck in the 90s who have surgically removed their ability to enjoy anything because it's not
perfect, who have put so much into the old games they so vigorously defend that they've essentially incorporated the games into their self-identity (right down to the stupid usernames,) and anything that seems to threaten that- such as a sequel, which is inevitably viewed negatively- is seen as a personal attack. (
http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/08/users-treat-criticism-of-favorite-brands-as-threat-to-self-image.ars) Research seems to bear this out.
Nostalgia unchecked does more harm than good. The original DX is, to my mind, the greatest game ever made. But I recognize it has achieved this in spite of a lot of really, really broken things- everything from bad level design to just plain bad gameplay decisions, somehow all the lesser parts form a greater whole. Even the plot's silly, looking at it now, though it raised a lot of questions that were important in 2000 and that almost no other game was willing to raise. DXHR, with a more solid gameplay and story foundation, has still nailed the
feel of the original to within the 90th percentage, and that's more than I could ever have asked for a game released in 2011. But there are people here and elsewhere who will never enjoy it or even play it, because it's not 100% like Deus Ex and sucks their dick too. What a shame.
Warren's Spectre on 3/9/2011 at 18:24
Dethtoll game related usernames on a gaming forum makes pretty perfect sense to me without eliciting questions about anyone's self identity. I think most people who have criticised the game have constantly reiterated that they did indeed enjoy the game and played it the whole way through so again you're wrong there.
Rather than insulting people why don't you actually join in the debate and counter some of our criticisms instead of insulting us because we have a different view.
Aquinas on 3/9/2011 at 18:33
Quote Posted by dethtoll
They're still there. The problem isn't that they're no longer made by nerds for nerds. The problem is that they're not made for a bunch of useless tools stuck in the 90s who have surgically removed their ability to enjoy anything because it's not
perfect, who have put so much into the old games they so vigorously defend that they've essentially incorporated the games into their self-identity (right down to the stupid usernames,) and anything that seems to threaten that- such as a sequel, which is inevitably viewed negatively- is seen as a personal attack. (
http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/08/users-treat-criticism-of-favorite-brands-as-threat-to-self-image.ars) Research seems to bear this out.
Nostalgia unchecked does more harm than good. ...
I think I have lined out, what makes DX3 inferior to DX1 in my opinion ((
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136710&page=1)) no case of nostalgia. Nor have I surgically removed the ability to recognize and like a fresh/cool idea when I see one - like Minecraft for ie. I also recognize when a game is made with love and an eye for details (Fallout New Vegas).
DX3 is nothing of the things mentioned before. Heck there is almost zero environmental physics and only maps void of life. Its just one of the games that "pretends to be something". These games are made for people like you, who lost their ability to see the difference between finely crafted achievements of gaming history (dx1) and an all for the profit rip-off like dx3. Dx3 is self confident in citating Blade Runner, Robo Cop and its predecessor but adds NOTHING we haven't seen before. DX1 mix was unique at its time, DX3 mix just got old and is therefore not ground breaking like the original.
It makes me sad that a game which is only 80% as good as a 10 year old predecessor today has to be regarded "a good game compared to other modern games". There has been almost no more development after 2001 in regards of story telling, immersive game worlds etc.
