Garrett TMT on 11/4/2020 at 07:04
Hey hey :D
Unfortunately there are not that many German streamers or youtubecreators :3
I see newcomers but they play thief 2014 v_v
<Username> on 11/4/2020 at 08:00
Never played through the full game in English, neither T1 nor T2, so my view might be a bit skewed. But I played T3 with English voices and watched footage of the English versions of T1 and T2 online.
I prefer Torsten Michaelis (T2) over Stephen Russell as Garrett. Andreas Brucker (T1) does okay, but he does not have any moments that stand out to me. In contrast, some of Michaelis' line deliveries were really memorable, like when he quips how inviting the City looks from above at the beginning of Life of the Party or when he threatens Victoria before departing for Markham's Isle.
Karras sounds very different in English and German. In the English version, he sounds like he has an orofacial cleft. This could have led to he being an outsider. This in turn could have motivated him to despise society and to build robots who worship him all day. I like this element of character building in the English version. The downside of it is: The robots have the same speech impediment as their master. Listening to them tends to become annoying. In the German version, they ditched the speech impediment idea. They compensated by emphasizing the arrogance in Karras' voice. Joachim Tennstedt's take on the character is different from the English version: He sounds like a fanatic with some charisma. Probably fitting for the leader of a religious sect. In the German version, the robot minions are now also way less irritating to listen to. I never got tired of listening to them praising the builder and Karras.
The biggest strength of the German localization, however, are the voices of the guards. They all have professional voice acting and actually sound threatening when they are searching for you. In the English version, it often sounds like the programmers' themselves were trying to do the voices. It makes me cringe whenever I watch video footage of someone playing the English version of the game. This goes for both T1 and T2.
Starker on 11/4/2020 at 14:15
I think my biggest complaint about the German voice acting is that a lot of times they don't sound very invested -- it's more like they are narrating instead of acting. Like let's take the Thief 2 archer fight where you can really hear the anger and irritation in the guards voices in the original. For example, the guard lowering his voice at "...or we'll boil his knackers" makes it sound far more menacing and the switching his voice to a higher pitch at "Such slander will not be tolerated..." goes a long way to show how upset and outraged he is, as well as at "You've gone... you've gone too far this time...".
[video=youtube;IU8gMHDkH48]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IU8gMHDkH48[/video]
Udo on 12/4/2020 at 23:37
Quote Posted by Garrett TMT
Hey hey :D
Unfortunately there are not that many German streamers or youtubecreators :3
I see newcomers but they play thief 2014 v_v
Hey Garret :ebil:
Well, it might be an age issue...some younger gamers only know Thief 2014 and there are too many "wannabe Gronkhs"(to say it metaphorical).
At least Thief 2014 is fully localised, but then again, it´s just as forgettable as the game itself :ebil:
I try to create some videos of the german version in the future, however I don´t promise anything yet. But you will see yourself, if it´s the case :cool:
Quote Posted by <Username>
I prefer Torsten Michaelis (T2) over Stephen Russell as Garrett. Andreas Brucker (T1) does okay, but he does not have any moments that stand out to me. In contrast, some of Michaelis' line deliveries were really memorable, like when he quips how inviting the City looks from above at the beginning of Life of the Party or when he threatens Victoria before departing for Markham's Isle.
Karras sounds very different in English and German. In the English version, he sounds like he has an orofacial cleft. This could have led to he being an outsider. This in turn could have motivated him to despise society and to build robots who worship him all day. I like this element of character building in the English version. The downside of it is: The robots have the same speech impediment as their master. Listening to them tends to become annoying. In the German version, they ditched the speech impediment idea. They compensated by emphasizing the arrogance in Karras' voice. Joachim Tennstedt's take on the character is different from the English version: He sounds like a fanatic with some charisma. Probably fitting for the leader of a religious sect. In the German version, the robot minions are now also way less irritating to listen to. I never got tired of listening to them praising the builder and Karras.
The biggest strength of the German localization, however, are the voices of the guards. They all have professional voice acting and actually sound threatening when they are searching for you. In the English version, it often sounds like the programmers' themselves were trying to do the voices. It makes me cringe whenever I watch video footage of someone playing the English version of the game. This goes for both T1 and T2.
Well, in the end it´s a matter of taste. What I dislike about some of Michaelis´ VA is that the direction seems to be very shitty. I mean, they hire a professional VA, but can´t get the translations right? I mean, if he says about Angelwatch "I will take my tenament daily" it´s just downright wrong, because "I take my tenament every day of the week" has a different meaning. I mean, some of the texts a 10th grader could have translated better... :mad:
Also, sometimes he just sounds too jovial. Which doesn´t really fit Garrett.
In terms of Karras, yeah I pick the german Karras always over the original one. I listened a bit to the french version and they also had a more sophisticated and somehow arrogant sounding VA for it.
I also prefer the german guard voices for the most time(but the guard who shouts "stop at once and put your hands up" sounds better in English IMHO - the dialogue in the opera about the "watery stone" is also waaay better in the original version)...I especially like the "Benny" voice. Unfortunately the voice actor(Ben Hecker) died at the beginning of 2019.
Quote Posted by Starker
I think my biggest complaint about the German voice acting is that a lot of times they don't sound very invested -- it's more like they are narrating instead of acting. Like let's take the Thief 2 archer fight where you can really hear the anger and irritation in the guards voices in the original. For example, the guard lowering his voice at "...or we'll boil his knackers" makes it sound far more menacing and the switching his voice to a higher pitch at "Such slander will not be tolerated..." goes a long way to show how upset and outraged he is, as well as at "You've gone... you've gone too far this time...".
Well, again, the issue seemed to be bad direction of the voice acting. If they don´t tell the VAs how the intonation should be it´s the fault of Eidos Germany.
One thing I notice in general, with Thief fortunately not suffering too much from it: I have the impression they tried to make most games in german sounding funny even if they weren´t and the result was cringy. Maybe they had a false conception of gamers back then. The ape beasts sound a bit like from a comedy show in the german version, but here it´s fortunately fitting.
Anfortas on 13/4/2020 at 13:05
Quote Posted by <Username>
Never played through the full game in English, neither T1 nor T2, so my view might be a bit skewed. But I played T3 with English voices and watched footage of the English versions of T1 and T2 online.
I prefer Torsten Michaelis (T2) over Stephen Russell as Garrett. Andreas Brucker (T1) does okay, but he does not have any moments that stand out to me. In contrast, some of Michaelis' line deliveries were really memorable, like when he quips how inviting the City looks from above at the beginning of Life of the Party or when he threatens Victoria before departing for Markham's Isle.
Karras sounds very different in English and German. In the English version, he sounds like he has an orofacial cleft. This could have led to he being an outsider. This in turn could have motivated him to despise society and to build robots who worship him all day. I like this element of character building in the English version. The downside of it is: The robots have the same speech impediment as their master. Listening to them tends to become annoying. In the German version, they ditched the speech impediment idea. They compensated by emphasizing the arrogance in Karras' voice. Joachim Tennstedt's take on the character is different from the English version: He sounds like a fanatic with some charisma. Probably fitting for the leader of a religious sect. In the German version, the robot minions are now also way less irritating to listen to. I never got tired of listening to them praising the builder and Karras.
The biggest strength of the German localization, however, are the voices of the guards. They all have professional voice acting and actually sound threatening when they are searching for you. In the English version, it often sounds like the programmers' themselves were trying to do the voices. It makes me cringe whenever I watch video footage of someone playing the English version of the game. This goes for both T1 and T2.
You are very on point with the things you've said about Karras German voice. I have never thought about it in much detail, but his charismatic voice in German seems to be fitting for a leader.
I agree with you, that the German voices of the guards are much better. To me, the English voices of the guards sound like they are drunk :D
As a funny note I want to add that Martin Keßler, who is the German voice of Truart, is also the voice of Nicolas Cage and Vin Diesel in a lot of movies.
zappenduster on 13/4/2020 at 14:56
Quote Posted by Udo
Well, in the end it´s a matter of taste. What I dislike about some of Michaelis´ VA is that the direction seems to be very shitty. I mean, they hire a professional VA, but can´t get the translations right? I mean, if he says about Angelwatch "I will take my tenament daily" it´s just downright wrong, because "I take my tenament every day of the week" has a different meaning. I mean, some of the texts a 10th grader could have translated better...
As we recently discussed in an unpleasant context IMHO there can never be a 1:1 translation. If this is made 100% slavish the result often becomes ridiculus. There are idioms which don't exist in all languages, rimes, sayings ... why not express the same by using other, more euphonic words? OK, nobody is perfect but I never missed neither any information nor any entertainment value in the german or french version of thief. And I like to hear other phrases in game like "Tu trembles, vermine !", it's a funny variation although not literally translated. So what? I don't wrack my brain for that. :D
Starker on 13/4/2020 at 20:37
Quote Posted by Anfortas
You are very on point with the things you've said about Karras German voice. I have never thought about it in much detail, but his charismatic voice in German seems to be fitting for a leader.
The problem is that he isn't a charismatic leader, though. He's the head of a cult and he has been mocked and spurned by the society at large, which is probably one of the reasons he devoted himself on technology and rose through the ranks. It was only when his cult became powerful and wealthy (thanks in no small part to his innovations, it seems) that the nobles started to pay any attention to him. He's more of a Bill Gates than Steve Jobs, if that makes sense.
Udo on 16/4/2020 at 13:01
Quote Posted by zappenduster
As we recently discussed in an unpleasant context IMHO there can never be a 1:1 translation. If this is made 100% slavish the result often becomes ridiculus. There are idioms which don't exist in all languages, rimes, sayings ... why not express the same by using other, more euphonic words? OK, nobody is perfect but I never missed neither any information nor any entertainment value in the german or french version of thief. And I like to hear other phrases in game like "Tu trembles, vermine !", it's a funny variation although not literally translated. So what? I don't wrack my brain for that. :D
I agree that certain things can´t be translated 1:1, but the examples I listed are just sloppiness.
I still pick the german version over the english one, but only a bit reluctantly.
Don´t know about the french version...I haven´t played it yet aside a short look into TDP, and don´t plan to do it. I don´t like french as a language, the french Garrett sounds awful and most importantly I don´t understand it.
Quote Posted by Starker
The problem is that he isn't a charismatic leader, though. He's the head of a cult and he has been mocked and spurned by the society at large, which is probably one of the reasons he devoted himself on technology and rose through the ranks. It was only when his cult became powerful and wealthy (thanks in no small part to his innovations, it seems) that the nobles started to pay any attention to him. He's more of a Bill Gates than Steve Jobs, if that makes sense.
Not to discuss Jobs vs. Gates, but from where comes the presumption that Karras was mocked? From my understanding he left the Hammerites for his own cult because he wasn´t satisfied with the conservatism of the order - they didn´t want technical progress and Karras thought this was not what the Builder wanted. That he developed a god complex later is another story.
He can´t be viewed as a chump, because he was praised for his sermons. Just my thoughts about that.
Oh, and another reason I like the german Gold version more :ebil: :
(
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSTw5vDSMOg)
The epic Mage KO sound..
Starker on 16/4/2020 at 20:51
Well, he talks and writes about how the city spurned him and the nobility made fun of him behind his back, for example:
Quote:
The Builder smiled on the things Karras had done. Out of devotion, He had invented many machines, and these machines now served Him well. He had transformed wretched humans into agents of The Builder's will, controlled directly by the influence of Karras' machines. These were called Servants, and they had been embraced by those in the city who considered themselves superior because of the wealth of their coffers instead of their spirits.
These same people had beamed at Karras with one face but with another face smirked amongst each other and shared affronts.
For this Karras had once detested them, but He saw now their role in the Builder's Plan. In all these things Karras had forged the tools that He would use to bring the Builder's Paradise to the world. The Builder looked upon these tools as Karras made preparations to put them to use, and His gaze showed favor, and Karras felt the Builder's hands upon Him and the Builder's strength helping Karras carry His burdens.
Quote:
To assist his calculations Karras drafted a map of the city, and now He saw the circles He had drawn and was pleased. Nowhere was there a place that would be uncleansed by the Necrotic Mutox, and its effects would extend beyond the city. The circles conjoined in the center, the very heart of the city,
the same city that had spurned Karras and denounced The Builder. Karras knew from this sign that all was to be as He had seen.
Seems like he was only praised for his sermons because he became rich and influential and people wanted to curry favour with him.
Child Of Karras on 4/5/2020 at 21:07
Hey! Another fellow German here.
I played both versions (though english not completely) and also I prefer the German versions for reasons already mentioned. They just sound more professional. The English guards sound like amateur theater with someone squeezing his throat to sound like a hard guy.
And of course Martin Keßler. Whenever I see a movie with Nicolas Cage there's this line in my head saying "Jaaa.... es freut mich wirklich wahnsinnig, dass der Erbauer euch leitet..."